-
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
@phoenetia They've put the blanket title of 'alt-right' or 'far right' onto anyone who doesn't follow leftist ideology. From Charlottesville Alt-right is now murderous nazism. This really scares me.
I dont see people calling Conservatives the alt-right however I feel that Conservatives aren't quite as vocal with their condemnation of the Alt Right as they should be and thats been my view on this forum too. Ive seen Alt Right points/memes parroted here before (not the racist variety) however I struggle to recall any Right leaning folk here ever calling out the Alt Right on their more offensive positions (thats not to say its never happened, I've just not seen it when I've been browsing here). Because of that, I tend towards thinking that most RW folk are ok with the Alt Right because I see more agreement rather than condemnation for them.
I can see where your concerns stem from and how you may feel a target because of others whose beliefs you dont share.
It sounds similar to the fear of many on the left who feel that Charlottesville is evidence of emboldened White Supremacists rising up and that the presidents failure to call it out adequately will result in it growing in popularity.
The next conflict between the Far Left and the Far Right will be very violent. There are thugs in the ANTIFA who seem to be spoiling for a fight; Charlottesville was a clear display of presence and firepower from the White Supremacists and no doubt ANTIFA will want to knock them down a number of pegs. What follows is going to be ugly and bloody.I think ANTIFA will be even more emboldened. The media and politicians have basically said they can do whatever they want because. .. Nazis .
It is bloody retarded to think peace and unity will be achieved by only blaming one side.
As for us defending the alt right. I don't even know who that is supposed to be. Seems to be whoever disagrees with the left. As for "offensive positions" ...offensive according to who? Are you going to start calling out over the positions the neo Marxists have ' that others might find "offensive"? -
As for the effect in Trump. It seems like this should really hurt him. But will it? Seems like all the usuall people who don't like him were the ones attacking him. Just more noise from the usual groups and people. Reminds me alot of the election. Remember the Access Hollywood tapes? I think the argument that both sides are violent is a much easier defense.
-
The is no group called the 'alt-right', it is a term coined by Spencer
Those that want a white ethno-state are alt-right. If you want a broader definition then you can throw in the 'racial realists'.
There is another group of people who aren't alt-right but are a reaction to the progressive movement. At times some in this group have attempted to define themselves as 'new right', the label has not stuck.. because its shit
The alt right has called them 'alt light'
The alt right has been attacking this group is quite horrible ways. Threatening family members, attacking various people for race mixing etc etc. The attacks from the alt right to this group are similar in intensity and nastiness to their attacks on progressives.
Michael Malice has a book coming out shorty that discusses alt right/alt light/new right. He makes a good point that the only thing the have in common is their opposition to progressives.
Ignoring the alt right for a second, the so called alt light don't really have a shared belief.. in fact I would place many of them as left of centre. The only thing that defines them is the opposition to progressivism (which is worth noting is a subset of the left, not all leftists are progressives)Now this is where the category error comes into it..
Some progressives seem to be conflating the alt right with the new right/alt light. All of these people oppose progressives, so therefore they are all alt right
Thats like the classic logic mistake - all cats are mammals, all dogs are mammals, therefore all cats are dogs
It is genuinely retarded
Are the progressives who do this that retarded? Well I am constantly surprised by peoples stupidity, so perhaps it is just a case of being spectacularly stupid.
However I think the misuse of the term alt right is probably deliberate. It's a useful tool to say everyone who disagrees with me is evil. If they are evil then you don't need to engage in conversation with them..
-
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
@phoenetia They've put the blanket title of 'alt-right' or 'far right' onto anyone who doesn't follow leftist ideology. From Charlottesville Alt-right is now murderous nazism. This really scares me.
I dont see people calling Conservatives the alt-right however I feel that Conservatives aren't quite as vocal with their condemnation of the Alt Right as they should be and thats been my view on this forum too. Ive seen Alt Right points/memes parroted here before (not the racist variety) however I struggle to recall any Right leaning folk here ever calling out the Alt Right on their more offensive positions (thats not to say its never happened, I've just not seen it when I've been browsing here). Because of that, I tend towards thinking that most RW folk are ok with the Alt Right because I see more agreement rather than condemnation for them.
I can see where your concerns stem from and how you may feel a target because of others whose beliefs you dont share.
It sounds similar to the fear of many on the left who feel that Charlottesville is evidence of emboldened White Supremacists rising up and that the presidents failure to call it out adequately will result in it growing in popularity.
The next conflict between the Far Left and the Far Right will be very violent. There are thugs in the ANTIFA who seem to be spoiling for a fight; Charlottesville was a clear display of presence and firepower from the White Supremacists and no doubt ANTIFA will want to knock them down a number of pegs. What follows is going to be ugly and bloody.What is the Alt-right and what non-racist Alt-right views have you seen parroted here? This seems to be absurd as labelling someone a communist because they believe in workers rights. But communists believe that too right?
It sounds similar to the fear of many on the left who feel that Charlottesville is evidence of emboldened White Supremacists rising up and that the presidents failure to call it out adequately will result in it growing in popularity.italicised text
This is just ridiculous. There were what, a couple of hundred people at that rally. And this is enough to trigger fear of an emboldened White Supremacist movement? There are probably more people in the US speaking Klingon. Get a grip.
-
@No-Quarter said in US Politics:
“Racism is not dead, but it is on life support – kept alive by politicians, race hustlers and people who get a sense of superiority by denouncing others as ‘racists’”
— Thomas SowellOff on a tangent..
Sowell was brilliant. He had that skill of being able to present complex arguments logically and with regular language.
This Firing Line episode from 1981 is interesting. The cultural arguments are so similar to today.. so little has changed (probably related to that quote above)
About 40mins in there is aombudsmanombudslady who manages to annoy him a little. It's like she wasn't even listening and just went through her pre prepared objections -
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
@phoenetia They've put the blanket title of 'alt-right' or 'far right' onto anyone who doesn't follow leftist ideology. From Charlottesville Alt-right is now murderous nazism. This really scares me.
I dont see people calling Conservatives the alt-right however I feel that Conservatives aren't quite as vocal with their condemnation of the Alt Right as they should be and thats been my view on this forum too. Ive seen Alt Right points/memes parroted here before (not the racist variety) however I struggle to recall any Right leaning folk here ever calling out the Alt Right on their more offensive positions (thats not to say its never happened, I've just not seen it when I've been browsing here). Because of that, I tend towards thinking that most RW folk are ok with the Alt Right because I see more agreement rather than condemnation for them.
I can see where your concerns stem from and how you may feel a target because of others whose beliefs you dont share.
It sounds similar to the fear of many on the left who feel that Charlottesville is evidence of emboldened White Supremacists rising up and that the presidents failure to call it out adequately will result in it growing in popularity.
The next conflict between the Far Left and the Far Right will be very violent. There are thugs in the ANTIFA who seem to be spoiling for a fight; Charlottesville was a clear display of presence and firepower from the White Supremacists and no doubt ANTIFA will want to knock them down a number of pegs. What follows is going to be ugly and bloody.I think ANTIFA will be even more emboldened. The media and politicians have basically said they can do whatever they want because. .. Nazis .
It is bloody retarded to think peace and unity will be achieved by only blaming one side.
As for us defending the alt right. I don't even know who that is supposed to be. Seems to be whoever disagrees with the left. As for "offensive positions" ...offensive according to who? Are you going to start calling out over the positions the neo Marxists have ' that others might find "offensive"?ANTIFA has always considered themselves justified in their actions - from their perspective, they're fighting the fascists and racists. When it comes to NeoNazis / White Supremacists, its very much about not being silent like what happened in Germany as Nazism rose to prominence.
Offensive = racist.
Like I said before, it isn't everyone who disagrees with the left but if one is parroting their talking points and memes in the same vocabulary, well, one might find themselves mistaken for an alt righter(?).
Who are the Neo Marxists? Are they the same as Cultural Marxists? Are they all Alt Left? Ive never even heard of anyone identifying as Neo Marxist. Please let me know if I should be triggered -
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
@phoenetia They've put the blanket title of 'alt-right' or 'far right' onto anyone who doesn't follow leftist ideology. From Charlottesville Alt-right is now murderous nazism. This really scares me.
I dont see people calling Conservatives the alt-right however I feel that Conservatives aren't quite as vocal with their condemnation of the Alt Right as they should be and thats been my view on this forum too. Ive seen Alt Right points/memes parroted here before (not the racist variety) however I struggle to recall any Right leaning folk here ever calling out the Alt Right on their more offensive positions (thats not to say its never happened, I've just not seen it when I've been browsing here). Because of that, I tend towards thinking that most RW folk are ok with the Alt Right because I see more agreement rather than condemnation for them.
I can see where your concerns stem from and how you may feel a target because of others whose beliefs you dont share.
It sounds similar to the fear of many on the left who feel that Charlottesville is evidence of emboldened White Supremacists rising up and that the presidents failure to call it out adequately will result in it growing in popularity.
The next conflict between the Far Left and the Far Right will be very violent. There are thugs in the ANTIFA who seem to be spoiling for a fight; Charlottesville was a clear display of presence and firepower from the White Supremacists and no doubt ANTIFA will want to knock them down a number of pegs. What follows is going to be ugly and bloody.I think ANTIFA will be even more emboldened. The media and politicians have basically said they can do whatever they want because. .. Nazis .
It is bloody retarded to think peace and unity will be achieved by only blaming one side.
As for us defending the alt right. I don't even know who that is supposed to be. Seems to be whoever disagrees with the left. As for "offensive positions" ...offensive according to who? Are you going to start calling out over the positions the neo Marxists have ' that others might find "offensive"?ANTIFA has always considered themselves justified in their actions - from their perspective, they're fighting the fascists and racists. When it comes to NeoNazis / White Supremacists, its very much about not being silent like what happened in Germany as Nazism rose to prominence.
Offensive = racist.
Like I said before, it isn't everyone who disagrees with the left but if one is parroting their talking points and memes in the same vocabulary, well, one might find themselves mistaken for an alt righter(?).
Who are the Neo Marxists? Are they the same as Cultural Marxists? Are they all Alt Left? Ive never even heard of anyone identifying as Neo Marxist. Please let me know if I should be triggeredHang on.. how does it matter how ANTIFA see themselves? I am sure the White Nationalists see themselves as fighting evil as well. ANTIFA are fascists. They are petty much carbon copies of Hitlers crew.
As for offensive equaling racism? Fair enough.. but a couple of questions.. do you believe people can be racist towards whites? And why stop at skin colour.. why not find it offensive when you assess and judge people based on immutable traits.. i.e identity politics.. which is now the default position of the left.
You have never heard of anyone identifying as neo Marxist? I have. I havent heard of people identifying as alt right either, I mainly hear people being labelled as alt right.
And you still havent really clarified what the alt right is. -
@phoenetia thanks for letting us know your thoughts, I was super curious as to how Gollum made the jump from what we've been discussing to somehow being in support of racism and your explanation goes someway to explain that even though I disagree.
When I have discussions about this I find people already firmly in an opinion camp completely misread what I write and argue against a point I haven't made. If I was to say Trump was misrepresented by the press on calling Mexicans rapists, they take that to mean that I support everything Trump says and that I hate Mexicans. It's quite phenomenal how that happens and always when I ask where exactly did I say that made them reach that conclusion they start going down the route of 'It's just your rhetoric'. The reality is people are putting their own biased beliefs into what someone says and insinuating their own meaning that is totally devoid from fact. I think you'll find those examples where you felt we were propagating alt-right (as it is currently defined ie white nationalist) opinions are examples of that, if you could find explicit examples that'd be great or if you see any going forward that would be great too.
When I first heard of Alt-right it was through the lens of being the kind of guy that got his news from 'The Guardian' or 'The Independent'. According to them Milo was the king of Alt-right and also a Nazi. I then listened to some of his talks to see what this horrible nasty agitator was saying and why it was totally correct to riot to stop him speaking.
The problem was actually watching his talks he wasn't a Nazi in the least. Controversial, sure, but he backed up his statements with some strong arguments and facts. Totally misrepresented in mainstream media and from this I ascertained that if he was the leader of the Alt-right then that means that the alt-right were just people with a different opinion that was largely supported by very strong arguments (clearly that definition has now changed over the last few weeks).
From this I looked into the media representation of Trump's speeches and compared them to his actual words, again he had been totally misrepresented.
I then started listening to Dave Rubin and Jordan Peterson who also were pointing out this disparity with what is being presented and what was actually true. They too are now labelled by many media as far right or alt-right.
I'm now halfway through the Qu'ran and scared as shit about that religion because it sure as shit not about peace and stopping people from being able to criticise it is absolutely criminal.
It's amazing and terrifying what you find when you go to the source and avoid mainstream media narratives. Another great exercise which also pushed me away from my former beliefs is trying to find some source material where Steve Bannon is actually being racist. It simply doesn't exist as hard as I tried to find it..yet that didn't stop the Nazi headlines when he was appointed his current position.
-
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
@phoenetia They've put the blanket title of 'alt-right' or 'far right' onto anyone who doesn't follow leftist ideology. From Charlottesville Alt-right is now murderous nazism. This really scares me.
I dont see people calling Conservatives the alt-right however I feel that Conservatives aren't quite as vocal with their condemnation of the Alt Right as they should be and thats been my view on this forum too. Ive seen Alt Right points/memes parroted here before (not the racist variety) however I struggle to recall any Right leaning folk here ever calling out the Alt Right on their more offensive positions (thats not to say its never happened, I've just not seen it when I've been browsing here). Because of that, I tend towards thinking that most RW folk are ok with the Alt Right because I see more agreement rather than condemnation for them.
I can see where your concerns stem from and how you may feel a target because of others whose beliefs you dont share.
It sounds similar to the fear of many on the left who feel that Charlottesville is evidence of emboldened White Supremacists rising up and that the presidents failure to call it out adequately will result in it growing in popularity.
The next conflict between the Far Left and the Far Right will be very violent. There are thugs in the ANTIFA who seem to be spoiling for a fight; Charlottesville was a clear display of presence and firepower from the White Supremacists and no doubt ANTIFA will want to knock them down a number of pegs. What follows is going to be ugly and bloody.What is the Alt-right and what non-racist Alt-right views have you seen parroted here? This seems to be absurd as labelling someone a communist because they believe in workers rights. But communists believe that too right?
It sounds similar to the fear of many on the left who feel that Charlottesville is evidence of emboldened White Supremacists rising up and that the presidents failure to call it out adequately will result in it growing in popularity.italicised text
This is just ridiculous. There were what, a couple of hundred people at that rally. And this is enough to trigger fear of an emboldened White Supremacist movement? There are probably more people in the US speaking Klingon. Get a grip.
Its the Breitbart articles and shitty 4chan-esque memes, the Regressive Left this, Gender Politics that, yay Bannon, yay Milo, boo MultiCulturalism, boo Islam, Cultural Marxist blather. Honestly, I thought some of you guys were alt-right so I'm more than happy to have you put your foot down and say it aint so.
If someone was in here espousing commie values, posting commie memes and sharing links from commie news sites - perhaps you might be right to suspect they are indeed a commie (but obviously not off one shared value as per your point).How many White Supremacists would you be comfortable with marching around in your town with torches chanting anti semitic racist crud bearing machine guns ? Even 1 is too many for my liking. For folk in America, this happened in their country. Americans are concerned this could happen in their town because it has already happened in an American town. The President failed to send a message that this shit is not on so I suspect that will motivate a large response from minorities and their supporters to ensure the White Supremacists get that message.
-
@Rembrandt Yep, you're right. I have to remind people in my circles that not all Trump supporters are racists. Im not even sure Trump is a racist, I think he just says shit (or not says stuff) that he thinks will poll well with his support... but maybe I need to revisit that line of thinking as he is polling terribly.
I dont agree with everything that you have posted but there's plenty there that I do agree with. The media does twist things and taking them at their word without validating their claims is dangerous. I've seen the clips of Trump where the press go to town on him for something ridiculous - I dont know why they do it, he already gives them plenty of bonafide material.
Cheers mate 👍 -
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
@phoenetia They've put the blanket title of 'alt-right' or 'far right' onto anyone who doesn't follow leftist ideology. From Charlottesville Alt-right is now murderous nazism. This really scares me.
I dont see people calling Conservatives the alt-right however I feel that Conservatives aren't quite as vocal with their condemnation of the Alt Right as they should be and thats been my view on this forum too. Ive seen Alt Right points/memes parroted here before (not the racist variety) however I struggle to recall any Right leaning folk here ever calling out the Alt Right on their more offensive positions (thats not to say its never happened, I've just not seen it when I've been browsing here). Because of that, I tend towards thinking that most RW folk are ok with the Alt Right because I see more agreement rather than condemnation for them.
I can see where your concerns stem from and how you may feel a target because of others whose beliefs you dont share.
It sounds similar to the fear of many on the left who feel that Charlottesville is evidence of emboldened White Supremacists rising up and that the presidents failure to call it out adequately will result in it growing in popularity.
The next conflict between the Far Left and the Far Right will be very violent. There are thugs in the ANTIFA who seem to be spoiling for a fight; Charlottesville was a clear display of presence and firepower from the White Supremacists and no doubt ANTIFA will want to knock them down a number of pegs. What follows is going to be ugly and bloody.I think ANTIFA will be even more emboldened. The media and politicians have basically said they can do whatever they want because. .. Nazis .
It is bloody retarded to think peace and unity will be achieved by only blaming one side.
As for us defending the alt right. I don't even know who that is supposed to be. Seems to be whoever disagrees with the left. As for "offensive positions" ...offensive according to who? Are you going to start calling out over the positions the neo Marxists have ' that others might find "offensive"?ANTIFA has always considered themselves justified in their actions - from their perspective, they're fighting the fascists and racists. When it comes to NeoNazis / White Supremacists, its very much about not being silent like what happened in Germany as Nazism rose to prominence.
Offensive = racist.
Like I said before, it isn't everyone who disagrees with the left but if one is parroting their talking points and memes in the same vocabulary, well, one might find themselves mistaken for an alt righter(?).
Who are the Neo Marxists? Are they the same as Cultural Marxists? Are they all Alt Left? Ive never even heard of anyone identifying as Neo Marxist. Please let me know if I should be triggeredHang on.. how does it matter how ANTIFA see themselves? I am sure the White Nationalists see themselves as fighting evil as well. ANTIFA are fascists. They are petty much carbon copies of Hitlers crew.
As for offensive equaling racism? Fair enough.. but a couple of questions.. do you believe people can be racist towards whites? And why stop at skin colour.. why not find it offensive when you assess and judge people based on immutable traits.. i.e identity politics.. which is now the default position of the left.
You have never heard of anyone identifying as neo Marxist? I have. I havent heard of people identifying as alt right either, I mainly hear people being labelled as alt right.
And you still havent really clarified what the alt right is.ANTIFA are AntiFascists, I know you know that. One can claim to be antifascist and not be ostracized, the same cannot be said of White Supremacists. People will openly support those who stick up for minorities. They dont tend to do so for White Supremacists.
How do you arrive at ANTIFA being carbon copies of Hitlers crew?
Yes, racism against whites is possible.
Its the historical legacy of racism and the shame thats attached to it that makes it so combustible compared to other forms of discrimination. -
-
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
@phoenetia They've put the blanket title of 'alt-right' or 'far right' onto anyone who doesn't follow leftist ideology. From Charlottesville Alt-right is now murderous nazism. This really scares me.
I dont see people calling Conservatives the alt-right however I feel that Conservatives aren't quite as vocal with their condemnation of the Alt Right as they should be and thats been my view on this forum too. Ive seen Alt Right points/memes parroted here before (not the racist variety) however I struggle to recall any Right leaning folk here ever calling out the Alt Right on their more offensive positions (thats not to say its never happened, I've just not seen it when I've been browsing here). Because of that, I tend towards thinking that most RW folk are ok with the Alt Right because I see more agreement rather than condemnation for them.
I can see where your concerns stem from and how you may feel a target because of others whose beliefs you dont share.
It sounds similar to the fear of many on the left who feel that Charlottesville is evidence of emboldened White Supremacists rising up and that the presidents failure to call it out adequately will result in it growing in popularity.
The next conflict between the Far Left and the Far Right will be very violent. There are thugs in the ANTIFA who seem to be spoiling for a fight; Charlottesville was a clear display of presence and firepower from the White Supremacists and no doubt ANTIFA will want to knock them down a number of pegs. What follows is going to be ugly and bloody.What is the Alt-right and what non-racist Alt-right views have you seen parroted here? This seems to be absurd as labelling someone a communist because they believe in workers rights. But communists believe that too right?
It sounds similar to the fear of many on the left who feel that Charlottesville is evidence of emboldened White Supremacists rising up and that the presidents failure to call it out adequately will result in it growing in popularity.italicised text
This is just ridiculous. There were what, a couple of hundred people at that rally. And this is enough to trigger fear of an emboldened White Supremacist movement? There are probably more people in the US speaking Klingon. Get a grip.
Its the Breitbart articles and shitty 4chan-esque memes, the Regressive Left this, Gender Politics that, yay Bannon, yay Milo, boo MultiCulturalism, boo Islam, Cultural Marxist blather. Honestly, I thought some of you guys were alt-right so I'm more than happy to have you put your foot down and say it aint so.
If someone was in here espousing commie values, posting commie memes and sharing links from commie news sites - perhaps you might be right to suspect they are indeed a commie (but obviously not off one shared value as per your point).How many White Supremacists would you be comfortable with marching around in your town with torches chanting anti semitic racist crud bearing machine guns ? Even 1 is too many for my liking. For folk in America, this happened in their country. Americans are concerned this could happen in their town because it has already happened in an American town. The President failed to send a message that this shit is not on so I suspect that will motivate a large response from minorities and their supporters to ensure the White Supremacists get that message.
I will ask again. Who or what is the Alt-right? Lumping Spencer together with someone like Milo is utterly ridiculous. Indeed lumping a media outlet formed by Jews and run by Jews (Breitart) is even more ridiculous. The opposite of that is everyone on the left being labelled a communist for espousing leftist talking-points. Do you not see how absurd and narrow-minded that is?
I don't care if a couple of hundred losers in a nation of 300 million decide to play "Triumph of the Wills". In fact, their pitiful number should be a clue that their influence is absolutely insignificant and rather than growing is at an all time low. Sure I'd like to see all white supremacism eradicated, but it's tin-foil territory to claim that there is some massive surge in their numbers or that they represent a threat to the US.
The rise in identity politics and cultural Marxism that you so casually dismiss as being the bastion of those horrible creatures of the alt-right like Jordan Pedersen are far bigger threats to the social fabric of the US than a few losers with tiki torches.
-
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@phoenetia said in US Politics:
@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
@phoenetia They've put the blanket title of 'alt-right' or 'far right' onto anyone who doesn't follow leftist ideology. From Charlottesville Alt-right is now murderous nazism. This really scares me.
I dont see people calling Conservatives the alt-right however I feel that Conservatives aren't quite as vocal with their condemnation of the Alt Right as they should be and thats been my view on this forum too. Ive seen Alt Right points/memes parroted here before (not the racist variety) however I struggle to recall any Right leaning folk here ever calling out the Alt Right on their more offensive positions (thats not to say its never happened, I've just not seen it when I've been browsing here). Because of that, I tend towards thinking that most RW folk are ok with the Alt Right because I see more agreement rather than condemnation for them.
I can see where your concerns stem from and how you may feel a target because of others whose beliefs you dont share.
It sounds similar to the fear of many on the left who feel that Charlottesville is evidence of emboldened White Supremacists rising up and that the presidents failure to call it out adequately will result in it growing in popularity.
The next conflict between the Far Left and the Far Right will be very violent. There are thugs in the ANTIFA who seem to be spoiling for a fight; Charlottesville was a clear display of presence and firepower from the White Supremacists and no doubt ANTIFA will want to knock them down a number of pegs. What follows is going to be ugly and bloody.I think ANTIFA will be even more emboldened. The media and politicians have basically said they can do whatever they want because. .. Nazis .
It is bloody retarded to think peace and unity will be achieved by only blaming one side.
As for us defending the alt right. I don't even know who that is supposed to be. Seems to be whoever disagrees with the left. As for "offensive positions" ...offensive according to who? Are you going to start calling out over the positions the neo Marxists have ' that others might find "offensive"?ANTIFA has always considered themselves justified in their actions - from their perspective, they're fighting the fascists and racists. When it comes to NeoNazis / White Supremacists, its very much about not being silent like what happened in Germany as Nazism rose to prominence.
Offensive = racist.
Like I said before, it isn't everyone who disagrees with the left but if one is parroting their talking points and memes in the same vocabulary, well, one might find themselves mistaken for an alt righter(?).
Who are the Neo Marxists? Are they the same as Cultural Marxists? Are they all Alt Left? Ive never even heard of anyone identifying as Neo Marxist. Please let me know if I should be triggeredHang on.. how does it matter how ANTIFA see themselves? I am sure the White Nationalists see themselves as fighting evil as well. ANTIFA are fascists. They are petty much carbon copies of Hitlers crew.
As for offensive equaling racism? Fair enough.. but a couple of questions.. do you believe people can be racist towards whites? And why stop at skin colour.. why not find it offensive when you assess and judge people based on immutable traits.. i.e identity politics.. which is now the default position of the left.
You have never heard of anyone identifying as neo Marxist? I have. I havent heard of people identifying as alt right either, I mainly hear people being labelled as alt right.
And you still havent really clarified what the alt right is.ANTIFA are AntiFascists, I know you know that. One can claim to be antifascist and not be ostracized, the same cannot be said of White Supremacists. People will openly support those who stick up for minorities. They dont tend to do so for White Supremacists.
How do you arrive at ANTIFA being carbon copies of Hitlers crew?
Yes, racism against whites is possible.
Its the historical legacy of racism and the shame thats attached to it that makes it so combustible compared to other forms of discrimination.Of course i know what they claim to be. Doesn't mean a damn thing.They are fascists. Since when does naming yourself something make you that? If the KKK rename themseles as African American Support League... does that change what and who they are??
Do you really want me to show it?http://www.dailywire.com/news/19717/7-things-you-need-know-about-antifa-michael-qazvini#exit-modal
ANTIFA are more dangerous than the White Supremacist movement (in potential not ideology). White Supremacist arent getting anywhere, ANTIFA are getting legitimized and open ticket for violence and suppression of free speech.
-
-
@Rembrandt said in US Politics:
Trump is 100% correct here in his comments about Charlottesville.
Seriously fuck the mainstream media who are trying to sell this as him defending neo-nazis.They are creating an incredibly dangerous situation by trying to justify Antifa's actions.
I had just read (hugely negative) reports and seen edited footage and thought that the stupid prick had put his foot in it again. I refer in particular to the "fine people" comment which was a WTF moment. But watching the full presser you can clearly see what he was trying to say and how the media were having none of it. One guy even asked him if he supported the Confederacy. If he's a disgrace to the presidency he's in good company, because they're a disgrace to journalism.
It would be worth seeing him win 2020 just to see this gaggle of dickheads lose their shit once again.
-
I think Trumps use of the phrase 'alt left' is going to get used more and more as well. Will be equally vacuous and meaninglessly generic, but it will be very effective.
-
Charlottesville comments seem to be here, so:
How about this for a bad weekend?
As a rule, I mostly follow Popper's paradox of tolerance before Rawl's (who I mostly identify with more strongly), so I'm kind of down with identifying white nationalists who were marching. However, one dangerous part of that nowadays is people calling out intolerant individuals - who weren't there.
US Politics