Springboks v England - Test #1
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From The Times.
ick Isiekwe can comfort himself this morning with the knowledge he is not the first and almost certainly won’t be the last England player Eddie Jones hooks from the field before half-time in a Test match.
The 20-year-old Saracens forward, in only his third Test appearance, suffered the ignominy of being replaced by uncapped New Zealander Brad Shields just 36 minutes into an extraordinary first Test as England’s head coach sought to restore some order. Unlike on previous occasions, the ploy failed to work.
Isiekwe looked shocked when the call came to replace him as he paid the price for a collective engine failure from England’s pack, suffering badly in the thin Johannesburg air following a breathless start.
I recall him doing the same to Teimana Harrison. Don't know who else he has yanked before half time, Need an account to read the rest of the fire-walled article. This was the first item on google search of Isiekwe when I wanted to check how old he was.
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so what are the odds of 6 in row for Steddie?
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pretty good I'd say, but then again SAF looked frail and are very inexperienced.
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@taniwharugby said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
so what are the odds of 6 in row for Steddie?
Increasing. Springboks will only be better for the run. England will be disintegrating mentally.
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@antipodean said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@taniwharugby said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
so what are the odds of 6 in row for Steddie?
Increasing. Springboks will only be better for the run. England will be disintegrating mentally.
We can only dream 😁
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@rapido said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@rapido said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
Was Shields sub for Isiekwe before half time an injury sub?
To answer my own question, tactical sub.
Eddie picks a young 20 year old lock to tour, at the expense of him going to the U-20 JWC. Starts him after Launchbury is withdrawn. Subs him after 35 minutes.
Humiliating.
Either - What a terrible selector (if he isn't good enough to play a test and had to be yanked) or what a terrible man manger he is (if he just wanted a tactical switch at the expense of humiliating a 20 year old almost debutant ).
Was his starting debut I believe, 3rd test match.
Wait what? He hooked him before half time. That is seriously fucked up. He couldn't have been playing that badly to deserve that surely? Yes professional game etc etc but that will absolutely destroy his confidence, not to mention any future relationship with Steady Eddie.
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You do have to wonder if Eddie was just so desperate to get Sheilds on the field come what may. I felt beforehand that his squad selection was unbalanced and this came home to bite us. We lost a game we should have had tied up at half time.
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@catogrande said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
You do have to wonder if Eddie was just so desperate to get Sheilds on the field come what may. I felt beforehand that his squad selection was unbalanced and this came home to bite us. We lost a game we should have had tied up at half time.
Was he actually playing that bad?
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@machpants said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
Hooked at around 35 minutes, a English born and bred lock replaced by a kiwi born and bred 6/8 - utterly bizarre
Utterly bizarre but also utterly Eddie.
I'm not writing England off yet, they have enough big, fit skilled players that every now and again the stars will align and they will smash out a good performance. Let's hope it isn't against us.
Eddies biggest problem is that at the moment he should have a well oiled core to his machine and be tinkering at the edges to get the extras but he is in a position of having a team fast losing confidence in his ability to iron out their issues. He is putting the blame on them even if wording it as 'it's my job to solve their problems'.
As many said when he took the job, he is a brilliant coach at coming in and lifting a team with immediate changes or surprising opposition with a clever gameplan but long term he doesn't bring the slow incremental improvements and standards of a top team.
Compare England and Ireland and its a bit hare and tortoise. England raced out of the blocks in this 4 year cycle while Ireland took a more measured approach that has established much more structure and resilience.
It will certainly be interesting to watch what Eddie does now. I feel like he isn't far from trying something drastic given that he looks to have painted himself (and the tem) into a corner.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@catogrande said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
You do have to wonder if Eddie was just so desperate to get Sheilds on the field come what may. I felt beforehand that his squad selection was unbalanced and this came home to bite us. We lost a game we should have had tied up at half time.
Was he actually playing that bad?
Can't say I noticed, either good or bad.
Even if bad, just wait 4 more minutes. For the sake of the next 10 years your hoping/thinking you or your employer and successor are wanting to get out of this young lad.
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@rapido said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@catogrande said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
You do have to wonder if Eddie was just so desperate to get Sheilds on the field come what may. I felt beforehand that his squad selection was unbalanced and this came home to bite us. We lost a game we should have had tied up at half time.
Was he actually playing that bad?
Can't say I noticed, either good or bad.
Even if bad, just wait 4 more minutes. For the sake of the next 10 years your hoping/thinking you or your employer and successor are wanting to get out of this young lad.
Yep. It seems incredibly cruel and humiliating.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@catogrande said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
You do have to wonder if Eddie was just so desperate to get Sheilds on the field come what may. I felt beforehand that his squad selection was unbalanced and this came home to bite us. We lost a game we should have had tied up at half time.
Was he actually playing that bad?
IMO no, he was doing ok, but no doubt Eddie will have some stats to back up his decision. The bigger issue for me though is that you go in with a rookie and then have no specialist back up on the bench.
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@wreck-diver said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
England looked at the score board at 3-23 and said job done and stopped playing. SA went shit we need to start playing. Apparently when Billy came back everything would return to normal. He was totally ineffectual, but he will get 8 out of 10 from S Jones tomorrow in the Times
A little simplistic I think. England's problem was that South Africa were able to control the ball from about the 20th minute to the 40th minute. South Africa scored a try and then Robshaw gave away a stupid offside penalty when they were about to get the ball kicked back to them. Daly also kicked it out on the full. England basically gave South Africa 20 minutes with the ball on a great running track. It was poor game management from England.
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@catogrande said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@catogrande said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
You do have to wonder if Eddie was just so desperate to get Sheilds on the field come what may. I felt beforehand that his squad selection was unbalanced and this came home to bite us. We lost a game we should have had tied up at half time.
Was he actually playing that bad?
IMO no, he was doing ok, but no doubt Eddie will have some stats to back up his decision. The bigger issue for me though is that you go in with a rookie and then have no specialist back up on the bench.
Just saw the highlights. It was the other lock Itoje who farked up royally on the first try.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@catogrande said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@catogrande said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
You do have to wonder if Eddie was just so desperate to get Sheilds on the field come what may. I felt beforehand that his squad selection was unbalanced and this came home to bite us. We lost a game we should have had tied up at half time.
Was he actually playing that bad?
IMO no, he was doing ok, but no doubt Eddie will have some stats to back up his decision. The bigger issue for me though is that you go in with a rookie and then have no specialist back up on the bench.
Just saw the highlights. It was the other lock Itoje who farked up royally on the first try.
Itoje did a lot to help England lose that game.
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@crucial said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@catogrande said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
@catogrande said in Springboks v England - Test #1:
You do have to wonder if Eddie was just so desperate to get Sheilds on the field come what may. I felt beforehand that his squad selection was unbalanced and this came home to bite us. We lost a game we should have had tied up at half time.
Was he actually playing that bad?
IMO no, he was doing ok, but no doubt Eddie will have some stats to back up his decision. The bigger issue for me though is that you go in with a rookie and then have no specialist back up on the bench.
Just saw the highlights. It was the other lock Itoje who farked up royally on the first try.
Itoje did a lot to help England lose that game.
Yeah. He needs to take a deep breath and be a little more self aware.
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@bovidae @Machpants Launchbury declared fit, so you'd have to think he and Itoje would start.
