Music - Top 10's!
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@jc said in Music - Top 10's!:
@victor-meldrew Controversial opinion: Mick Avery was a better drummer than Keith Moon. There, I’ve said it.
Ginger Baker, John Bonham, Ian Paice and Bill Ward were/are as well.
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@jc said in Music - Top 10's!:
@victor-meldrew Controversial opinion: Mick Avery was a better drummer than Keith Moon. There, I’ve said it.
He played for the song like Charlie Watts and Ringo did. They were all key players in great bands - music first, ego second.
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@victor-meldrew said in Music - Top 10's!:
@jc said in Music - Top 10's!:
@victor-meldrew Controversial opinion: Mick Avery was a better drummer than Keith Moon. There, I’ve said it.
He played for the song like Charlie Watts and Ringo did. They were all key players in great bands - music first, ego second.
… which nobody could say about Ginger Baker with a straight face.
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@jc said in Music - Top 10's!:
@victor-meldrew said in Music - Top 10's!:
@jc said in Music - Top 10's!:
@victor-meldrew Controversial opinion: Mick Avery was a better drummer than Keith Moon. There, I’ve said it.
He played for the song like Charlie Watts and Ringo did. They were all key players in great bands - music first, ego second.
… which nobody could say about Ginger Baker with a straight face.
The longer the drum solo, the bigger the ego.
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@victor-meldrew said in Music - Top 10's!:
@jc said in Music - Top 10's!:
@victor-meldrew said in Music - Top 10's!:
@jc said in Music - Top 10's!:
@victor-meldrew Controversial opinion: Mick Avery was a better drummer than Keith Moon. There, I’ve said it.
He played for the song like Charlie Watts and Ringo did. They were all key players in great bands - music first, ego second.
… which nobody could say about Ginger Baker with a straight face.
The longer the drum solo, the bigger the ego.
I think Drum solos are the ultimate wank unless they’re pretty brief. I’m far more into cool fills and creative rhythms.
The live version of Moby Dick is just horrific. Sorry Bonham, and you know I love your group…..but I’m right.
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@mn5 said in Music - Top 10's!:
I think Drum solos are the ultimate wank unless they’re pretty brief. I’m far more into cool fills and creative rhythms.
Never sat down in front of a drum kit in my life, but have taken an interest in drumming techniques etc and have learned that what sounds really simple, but perfect for the song and the rest of the band, can actually be complex & extraordinarily difficult to play.
Big difference between drummers who are master technicians and drummers who are musicians.. Steve Gadd, of course, is both.
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@victor-meldrew said in Music - Top 10's!:
@mn5 said in Music - Top 10's!:
I think Drum solos are the ultimate wank unless they’re pretty brief. I’m far more into cool fills and creative rhythms.
Never sat down in front of a drum kit in my life, but have taken an interest in drumming techniques etc and have learned that what sounds really simple, but perfect for the song and the rest of the band, can actually be complex & extraordinarily difficult to play.
Big difference between drummers who are master technicians and drummers who are musicians.. Steve Gadd, of course, is both.
By far the biggest thing with drumming is feel. Plenty of techy drummers out there judging by youtube but you can do all the shit you want without feel and you will sound programmed.
A drummer that works with their bassist instead of alongside them is the other big attribute. Obviously one of the resons Moon was so good is that he worked with the Ox and the combo of the two together.Rick Beato does a good clip where he analyses a song deemed to have a great rhythm but to his ear it was mechanical. He lines up the track alongside a similar beat played by a good drummer and concludes that the first one has been auto-corrected as it is almost perfect while the 'real' one has slight variations all over with gives it much better feel. It is the second drummer that sounds so much better and surprisingly sounds more on beat.
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@crucial said in Music - Top 10's!:
He lines up the track alongside a similar beat played by a good drummer and concludes that the first one has been auto-corrected as it is almost perfect while the 'real' one has slight variations all over with gives it much better feel. It is the second drummer that sounds so much better and surprisingly sounds more on beat.
It's also about giving the song space and a strong rhythm. That isn't as easy as it sounds. Ringo's playing on Something is really slow & sparse at the start as it reflects the lyrics and mood. Then he whacks it up staccato-like during the bridge and then slows down again during the guitar solo with fills which almost reflect the previous lyrics. Apparently there are 4-5 changes to time signatures in the song and it's way more complex than it sounds but the rhythm is always rock-solid throughout the song.
It wouldn't be technically difficult to play for someone like Peart or Steve Gadd - but his composition is unique and absolutely perfect for the song. I guess that can only come from playing in a real live band.
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Overthinking it
Massively
Exhibit A
Does it get you going?
If yes, job done
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@mikethesnow i don't the song as it's saying unavailable but i applaud the sentiment
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@mariner4life said in Music - Top 10's!:
@mikethesnow i don't the song as it's saying unavailable but i applaud the sentiment
Spencer Davis Group - Keep on Running
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@crucial said in Music - Top 10's!:
@victor-meldrew said in Music - Top 10's!:
@mn5 said in Music - Top 10's!:
I think Drum solos are the ultimate wank unless they’re pretty brief. I’m far more into cool fills and creative rhythms.
Never sat down in front of a drum kit in my life, but have taken an interest in drumming techniques etc and have learned that what sounds really simple, but perfect for the song and the rest of the band, can actually be complex & extraordinarily difficult to play.
Big difference between drummers who are master technicians and drummers who are musicians.. Steve Gadd, of course, is both.
By far the biggest thing with drumming is feel. Plenty of techy drummers out there judging by youtube but you can do all the shit you want without feel and you will sound programmed.
A drummer that works with their bassist instead of alongside them is the other big attribute. Obviously one of the resons Moon was so good is that he worked with the Ox and the combo of the two together.Rick Beato does a good clip where he analyses a song deemed to have a great rhythm but to his ear it was mechanical. He lines up the track alongside a similar beat played by a good drummer and concludes that the first one has been auto-corrected as it is almost perfect while the 'real' one has slight variations all over with gives it much better feel. It is the second drummer that sounds so much better and surprisingly sounds more on beat.
Thats what Angus Young has always said about Phil Rudd. Chris Slade is the better drummer but Rudd has a much better feel and groove which he prefers to play with.
I don't know much about drumming as Chad Smith seems average (in the real use of the word, not derogatory) to me but is highly rated) and the reverse applies to Jon Otto (Limp Bizkit). I'd also say that Neil Peart seems to make things difficult for the sake of it, not so much because it sounds better.
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@majorrage said in Music - Top 10's!:
I'd also say that Neil Peart seems to make things difficult for the sake of it, not so much because it sounds better.
Yep. Compare the size of Charlie Watts' drum kit to Neil Peart's. Then ask which drummer was almost always better at supporting the band and making the songs sound so frickin' great? For me it's Charlie Watts every time.
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@majorrage said in Music - Top 10's!:
@crucial said in Music - Top 10's!:
@victor-meldrew said in Music - Top 10's!:
@mn5 said in Music - Top 10's!:
I think Drum solos are the ultimate wank unless they’re pretty brief. I’m far more into cool fills and creative rhythms.
Never sat down in front of a drum kit in my life, but have taken an interest in drumming techniques etc and have learned that what sounds really simple, but perfect for the song and the rest of the band, can actually be complex & extraordinarily difficult to play.
Big difference between drummers who are master technicians and drummers who are musicians.. Steve Gadd, of course, is both.
By far the biggest thing with drumming is feel. Plenty of techy drummers out there judging by youtube but you can do all the shit you want without feel and you will sound programmed.
A drummer that works with their bassist instead of alongside them is the other big attribute. Obviously one of the resons Moon was so good is that he worked with the Ox and the combo of the two together.Rick Beato does a good clip where he analyses a song deemed to have a great rhythm but to his ear it was mechanical. He lines up the track alongside a similar beat played by a good drummer and concludes that the first one has been auto-corrected as it is almost perfect while the 'real' one has slight variations all over with gives it much better feel. It is the second drummer that sounds so much better and surprisingly sounds more on beat.
Thats what Angus Young has always said about Phil Rudd. Chris Slade is the better drummer but Rudd has a much better feel and groove which he prefers to play with.
I don't know much about drumming as Chad Smith seems average (in the real use of the word, not derogatory) to me but is highly rated) and the reverse applies to Jon Otto (Limp Bizkit). I'd also say that Neil Peart seems to make things difficult for the sake of it, not so much because it sounds better.
It’s ironic his name was Phil cos he certainly never played any.
The AC/DC rhythm section do their job but it’s pretty basic stuff to ensure Angus and Brian shine like they do.
Chad Smith is awesome although Frusciante and Flea steal the limelight off him overall.
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@victor-meldrew said in Music - Top 10's!:
Yep. Compare the size of Charlie Watts' drum kit to Neil Peart's. Then ask which drummer was almost always better at supporting the band and making the songs sound so frickin' great? For me it's Charlie Watts every time.
It comes down to what the band wants from the drummer. Watts was like Ringo and even Mason in that they played what was required. I'm a big Peart fan and he reinvented himself numerous times throughout his career.
While speaking about drummers, I'd put Jeff Porcaro up there with anyone. It's no surprise he was so in demand as a session drummer and made the most difficult drum fills and time signatures look so easy.
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@bovidae said in Music - Top 10's!:
While speaking about drummers, I'd put Jeff Porcaro up there with anyone
When I read about drummers, he always seems to get the hat-tip from those in the know. Went way too young.
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@bovidae said in Music - Top 10's!:
While speaking about drummers, I'd put Jeff Porcaro up there with anyone. It's no surprise he was so in demand as a session drummer and made the most difficult drum fills and time signatures look so easy.
Everyone does. Talented and humble.
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