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@taniwharugby said in North Korea:
@duluth said in North Korea:
- Bad NK, sabre rattling
- Good NK, thawing relations
- Negotiating NK, gets some cash/aid before elongated talks break down
- Goto 1
They've been doing it for decades and it has been successful.
1 - Check
2 - Check
3 - Coming in May?Good use of the question mark. Seeing as the suggested meeting is going to be between two of the more volatile and unpredictable world leaders it is by no means a given. I hope to fuck it does occur as that would have to count as a real forward step but there’s still a ways to go yet.
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@snowy said in North Korea:
I don't think many of the people I know have been brainwashed.
Oh, Lordy. The last Republican president and All his Men launched a war based on a pack of lies, sold “greeted as liberator” dogshit, resulted in a massive destabilized region, the rise of ISIS, hundreds of thousands dead, a refugee crisis, trillions of dollars flushed down the U.S. Treasury, and it’s still not over. That, to me, is arrogant dickheadedness. I can’t see anywhere that Trump has done anything even remotely close to comparable. He has a brash New York swagger, and punches back hard. That’s it. Style over substance. That’s why most people hate him.
But . . . you probably don’t think many of the people you know have been brainwashed.
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There you go @Snowy
Conclusive proof.
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@catogrande said in North Korea:
There you go @Snowy
Conclusive proof.
Yes. It’s obvious. We are the brainwashed ones here.
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Like to point out where he is wrong? I am betting you cannot so you resort to nonsense
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It's not brainwashing, it's the fact that so many people only watch either very left leaning or very right leaning media. You do that, you only get half the story and often deliberately misleading information given the state of media today.
It'd be great of people genuinely made an effort to see both sides of the story before pushing their opinions and/or protesting etc. As @Duluth mentioned in another thread, the political turing test is worth keeping in mind on many of the more polarising issues (I.E. making a genuine effort to understand opposing arguments and ideas to the point that you could argue in favour of them).
I quite like a guy on youtube called 'Nuance Bro' who interviews people at protests etc, and depending what side they are he takes the other side.
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@baron-silas-greenback said in North Korea:
Like to point out where he is wrong? I am betting you cannot so you resort to nonsense
Are you saying I have been brainwashed by the left leaning media? If so that’s nonsense.
Salacious Crumbs posts are the flip side of the same coin as the idiots who instead of looking at the failings of their own side that lead to Trumps election twist everything he does into something terrible. In Salacious Crumbs mind Trump can do no wrong .If he can convince North Korea to hand over their nukes I’ll be the first to congratulate him on here, even getting them to meet is a significant accomplishment but as you said I suspect they are stalling for more time. The end game for the Koreas is tough to predict, reunification would probably bankrupt the south and Kim and his cronies have seen what happened to Gaddafi etc so are unlikely to want to loosen their grip anytime soon.
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@jegga said in North Korea:
Are you saying I have been brainwashed by the left leaning media? If so that’s nonsense.
You want an answer to that? I am not really interested in making this an attack on you. That wasn't what I was saying, but seen as you ask. Yeah actually I kinda do. I find pretty much anyone who detests Trumps presidency because they detest Trump is guilty of it. The MSM have feasted on a narrative of how much of a tool Trump is. Whilst doing absolutely everything they can to downplay his accomplishments. The MSM have created a mass hysteria about the guy, and the thing about mass hysteria is that the hysterical think they are perfectly rational. If anyone insists on watering down credit for Trumps accomplishments because they don't like him as a person is what I would define as brainwashed over this. I see basically zero interest in people seeing both sides. I criticize Trump far more than most on here give him credit, and if they do give credit they immediately wash it down with a bucket load of derision.
I could list example after example of things Obama did as a person that I think are far worse than what Trump has done. But ultimately I judge him by what he did as president which was at best nothing and at worse make the world a much less safe place.
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@baron-silas-greenback I said even getting them to meet is a significant accomplishment and I’m brainwashed by the msm?
Trumps inherited a problem three previous administrations simply kicked the can down the road with and seems to be making some progress. Good luck to himMy point was it’s a bit rich for someone to accuse others of being brainwashed when he talks about a Trump the cult members talk about their leader. All politicians should be regarded with disdain imho , deifying them is unhealthy.
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@baron-silas-greenback said in North Korea:
Like to point out where he is wrong? I am betting you cannot so you resort to nonsense
Where he is wrong is that he lists a set of occurrences and suggests that is proof that many of the people @snowy knows are brainwashed. Care to point out where he is right on that point?
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@catogrande said in North Korea:
@baron-silas-greenback said in North Korea:
Like to point out where he is wrong? I am betting you cannot so you resort to nonsense
Where he is wrong is that he lists a set of occurrences and suggests that is proof that many of the people @snowy knows are brainwashed. Care to point out where he is right on that point?
Ahhh right I see your point.Fair enough.
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Pretty much.
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"North Korean leader Kim Jong Un says he is suspending nuclear and missile tests starting Saturday, and that he will shut down the site where the previous six nuclear tests were conducted".
What do you guys think of that? I think Trump playing Kim Jong Un at his own game has probably played a role, but am extremely sceptical about "announcements" like this. Seems more likely he is trying to take some heat off his regime and buy himself some time.
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@no-quarter said in North Korea:
"North Korean leader Kim Jong Un says he is suspending nuclear and missile tests starting Saturday, and that he will shut down the site where the previous six nuclear tests were conducted".
What do you guys think of that? I think Trump playing Kim Jong Un at his own game has probably played a role, but am extremely sceptical about "announcements" like this. Seems more likely he is trying to take some heat off his regime and buy himself some time.
Imagine if Obama had pulled this off.He would have won a Nobel prize. ... oh wait.
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What President Trump has pulled off here, having Kim agree to meet, is simply exceptional. What happens next is anyone's guess and, as the State Department's spokesman Heather Nauert continually reminds the press goons who demand to know the meeting date and time and the personnel list and accommodation room numbers, she is not going to get ahead of herself speculating what might be. The Washington media seems hell bent on torpedoing it all before the ship sets sail - they simply hate their own country that much and actively sabotage their President for offending them so (and earn an impressive quid for doing that exceptionally well).
Kim Jong-un may well string the US along for months just as Ho Chi Minh did in the Paris peace talks, he could seek asylum for his missus and kids, hand over a list of essential foodstuffs to feed the starving or simply kidnap Donald Trump and say "Go on, nuke us now ya turkeys!"
What Trump has achieved to date is similar in importance to Nixon's visit to China and his work crafting a peace with Russia in the early '70s, and with Reagan's successful pressure on Russia opening the Iron Curtain and felling the Berlin Wall - an incredible feat. He has already made impressive inroads in Asia, with China, Japan and South Korea. Simultaneously he has cranked the US economy markedly, had unemployment figures for blacks drop to decades old low levels, opened up local natural resources, halved the useless environmental department's otherwise unemployable workforce - whilst dealing with natural disasters in the Caribbean, Texas, Florida and California; endless accusations about Russians, hookers, beating up grannies and kicking passing dogs and cats.
The man is about 70 years old and he has done more in a year or so than that dilettante who preceded him did in eight years. Where he draws his energy is a mystery to me, his affection for the American way is no mystery and his preparedness to sacrifice his valuable time for all his countrymen is self evident. And he is not a snarling racist like the magic negro proved to be.
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@booboo said in North Korea:
Heard some commentary on the radio that the NK test facility in the mountains near China is completely fucked and on the verge of collapse. Thus they're halting testing because they can't any more (under some pressure from China).
Yeah the media are desperate to avoid crediting Trump. Totally pathetic.
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Media wanting to know all the details of the summit are as thick as the ones here who wanted to know all the text of the TPP while it was still being negotiated.
When you look at who’s involved, what’s at stake, and how the recent visit to China played out for Kim, we will hear about it very late in the piece.
North Korea