So we are about to get taxed up a storm!
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https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/110677332/biggest-tax-shakeup-for-a-generation
Best time to do this while they are polling so well compared to previous years. I'm not smiling though.
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they get you one way or another.
Not sure if they still have ISA's in the UK, but NZ really needs something similar to encourage savings, reduce or remove KIwisaver tax (guess it'd be too complicated to tax just on the gains made from Govt. contributions)
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Feels like something has to change, even if it's going to be hard. I do like their focus on keeping it as simple as possible. But that opens them up for criticism that it's not nuanced enough, or too crude.
If it makes it through do we think National will kill it immediately upon returning to office as they are saying? Or instead might retain it but make changes?
In an odd way this feels like our version of the USA's healthcare dilemma/firestorm. Emotive (and real world impact) stuff for sure!
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Cheers @Duluth I realised as soon as I post this, it was in wrong forum
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alot of the focus is on CGT, when it should be about adjusting all the tax brackets, given a good portion of 'middle income' NZ is in the top tax bracket.
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That bottom bracket should just go. It brings in FA tax in the wider scheme of things but for those that genuinely struggle it would make a difference.
I cannot fathom why successive governments have ignored this.
I'd far rather have seen cross party cooperation on CGT like there should be on Super as effectively the issues are linked. Instead it's bound to be a political football.
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@dogmeat said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
That bottom bracket should just go. It brings in FA tax in the wider scheme of things but for those that genuinely struggle it would make a difference.
I cannot fathom why successive governments have ignored this.
I'd far rather have seen cross party cooperation on CGT like there should be on Super as effectively the issues are linked. Instead it's bound to be a political football.
I hope Labour really hitch their wagon to CGT, it will cost them the next election.
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@dogmeat said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@Kirwan oh I agree that in all probability that'll be the outcome.
I'm for a consensus approach for the likes of you and your kids. I'm close enough to retirement to be a largely disinterested observer.
I'm fully expecting the top tax rate to go up as well. Politics of envy...
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@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@dogmeat said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
That bottom bracket should just go. It brings in FA tax in the wider scheme of things but for those that genuinely struggle it would make a difference.
I cannot fathom why successive governments have ignored this.
I'd far rather have seen cross party cooperation on CGT like there should be on Super as effectively the issues are linked. Instead it's bound to be a political football.
I hope Labour really hitch their wagon to CGT, it will cost them the next election.
Not if they up their flow of Neve pics into MSM
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@canefan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@dogmeat said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
That bottom bracket should just go. It brings in FA tax in the wider scheme of things but for those that genuinely struggle it would make a difference.
I cannot fathom why successive governments have ignored this.
I'd far rather have seen cross party cooperation on CGT like there should be on Super as effectively the issues are linked. Instead it's bound to be a political football.
I hope Labour really hitch their wagon to CGT, it will cost them the next election.
Not if they up their flow of Neve pics into MSM
People are easy to distract right up until you put your hand in their pockets.
Something else for you all to clarify, CGT exempts the family home. What about when you die, is it still the family home? Or does this turn into a stealth death tax as well?
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should be no tax payable on income under $20k, the low bracket should be upto $50k, the next $50k-$80k, 30% should be $80k-$120k and then the 33% for $120k+
All those in the 0 tax bracket will just give it back to the Govt. in GST anyway.
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@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@canefan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@dogmeat said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
That bottom bracket should just go. It brings in FA tax in the wider scheme of things but for those that genuinely struggle it would make a difference.
I cannot fathom why successive governments have ignored this.
I'd far rather have seen cross party cooperation on CGT like there should be on Super as effectively the issues are linked. Instead it's bound to be a political football.
I hope Labour really hitch their wagon to CGT, it will cost them the next election.
Not if they up their flow of Neve pics into MSM
People are easy to distract right up until you put your hand in their pockets.
Something else for you all to clarify, CGT exempts the family home. What about when you die, is it still the family home? Or does this turn into a stealth death tax as well?
I'm sure there will be lots of blue sky talk and little detail
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They are painting the CGT all wrong by claiming it will help reduce the gap bewteen 'rich and poor' because by saying it like that, it is just bringing the top down, rather than more importantly bringing those that work or cant due to accident/injury/illness at the bottom up (despite the fact the lazy fucks will benefit too)
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@taniwharugby said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
They are painting the CGT all wrong by claiming it will help reduce the gap bewteen 'rich and poor' because by saying it like that, it is just bringing the top down, rather than more importantly bringing those that work or cant due to accident/injury/illness at the bottom up (despite the fact the lazy fucks will benefit too)
They would be better off saying they want to try to lessen Kiwi's over-investment in property in favour of other investment vehicles
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@canefan plenty of better ways to paint it rather than take money from the hard working and yes some rich to simply make them closer to the poor (even if only a little bit in many cases)
I was talking to a guy last week, he was saying his son owns >100 houses in Auckland.
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Government has a shit load of work to do before anything happens. 1 April 2021 is a real challenge unless they go with a simplified approach.
Good summary available at https://www.pwc.co.nz/pdfs/tax-tips/tax-tips-february-2019.pdf
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@taniwharugby said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
should be no tax payable on income under $20k, the low bracket should be upto $50k, the next $50k-$80k, 30% should be $80k-$120k and then the 33% for $120k+
All those in the 0 tax bracket will just give it back to the Govt. in GST anyway.
They did consider a zero tax bracket but not alot of people actually stay in there. Most transition through so thought was to increase the top end of that lower bracket as a way to provide more relief at that point
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@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@canefan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@dogmeat said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
That bottom bracket should just go. It brings in FA tax in the wider scheme of things but for those that genuinely struggle it would make a difference.
I cannot fathom why successive governments have ignored this.
I'd far rather have seen cross party cooperation on CGT like there should be on Super as effectively the issues are linked. Instead it's bound to be a political football.
I hope Labour really hitch their wagon to CGT, it will cost them the next election.
Not if they up their flow of Neve pics into MSM
People are easy to distract right up until you put your hand in their pockets.
Something else for you all to clarify, CGT exempts the family home. What about when you die, is it still the family home? Or does this turn into a stealth death tax as well?
No stealth death tax proposed. There would be rollever provisions in place with things like death, seperations, business reorganisations and re-investment (depending on business size)
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@JK said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@canefan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@dogmeat said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
That bottom bracket should just go. It brings in FA tax in the wider scheme of things but for those that genuinely struggle it would make a difference.
I cannot fathom why successive governments have ignored this.
I'd far rather have seen cross party cooperation on CGT like there should be on Super as effectively the issues are linked. Instead it's bound to be a political football.
I hope Labour really hitch their wagon to CGT, it will cost them the next election.
Not if they up their flow of Neve pics into MSM
People are easy to distract right up until you put your hand in their pockets.
Something else for you all to clarify, CGT exempts the family home. What about when you die, is it still the family home? Or does this turn into a stealth death tax as well?
No stealth death tax proposed. There would be rollever provisions in place with things like death, seperations, business reorganisations and re-investment (depending on business size)
"The Group notes that the recommended
changes will have minimal impact on income
inequality. If the Government wishes to make a
significant impact, it will need to change the top
personal tax rates, which is outside the scope
of the Group’s Terms of Reference"Here it comes....
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Yeah there were some significant limits as to what they could and couldn't look in to. GST for example (which works pretty well) was off the agenda, so too moving the top tax rates.
As with pretty much anything with the current government, due to the coalition setup, old Winnie is going to be pretty key. That guys been both for and against a capital gains tax on and off over the years so will be interesting to see where he points NZ First this time.
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@JK said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
Yeah there were some significant limits as to what they could and couldn't look in to. GST for example (which works pretty well) was off the agenda, so too moving the top tax rates.
As with pretty much anything with the current government, due to the coalition setup, old Winnie is going to be pretty key. That guys been both for and against a capital gains tax on and off over the years so will be interesting to see where he points NZ First this time.
Awesome. It's just great relying on Winstone fucking Peters to be the voice of reason. Hopefully he's smart enough to know where is support stands on this issue. Those 3/4% poll results should be firmly in his mind.
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I have yet to actually hear a cohesive and logical argument for CGT except as a way of broadening the tax base.
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@JK said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@pakman said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
Any indication of what the rate might be? In UK CGT on shares @20%.
Its proposed that all capital gains should be taxed within the current tax system at the taxpayer’s marginal rates
So 33% right?
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@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@JK said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@pakman said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
Any indication of what the rate might be? In UK CGT on shares @20%.
Its proposed that all capital gains should be taxed within the current tax system at the taxpayer’s marginal rates
So 33% right?
Yeah if thats your marginal tax rate (assume it would be for most who are caught under the proposed CGT)
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@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
relying on Winstone fucking Peters
what has our world come to
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@JK said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@JK said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@pakman said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
Any indication of what the rate might be? In UK CGT on shares @20%.
Its proposed that all capital gains should be taxed within the current tax system at the taxpayer’s marginal rates
So 33% right?
Yeah if thats your marginal tax rate (assume it would be for most who are caught under the proposed CGT)
Highway robbery.
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@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
Are there any figures on how much it costs to collect the CGT? I heard some mention that it would cost almost as much to administer as it collected.
From an accountants perspective that sounds unlikely.
Given it doesn’t apply to the family home, most of the property/ shares etc will be held in some kind of company/ trust and we already calculate capital gains and losses on disposal. It’s just simply reporting that in a different way.
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@JK said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@Kirwan said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@JK said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
@pakman said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
Any indication of what the rate might be? In UK CGT on shares @20%.
Its proposed that all capital gains should be taxed within the current tax system at the taxpayer’s marginal rates
So 33% right?
Yeah if thats your marginal tax rate (assume it would be for most who are caught under the proposed CGT)
Much above 20% tax planning becomes worthwhile and take diminishes.
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It’s up now and it’s awful . This will probably cost them the next election
https://taxworkinggroup.govt.nz/sites/default/files/2019-02/twg-final-report-voli-feb19.pdf
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@jegga said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
It’s up now and it’s awful . This will probably cost them the next election
https://taxworkinggroup.govt.nz/sites/default/files/2019-02/twg-final-report-voli-feb19.pdf
We can only hope
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@jegga said in So we are about to get taxed up a storm!:
It’s up now and it’s awful . This will probably cost them the next election
https://taxworkinggroup.govt.nz/sites/default/files/2019-02/twg-final-report-voli-feb19.pdf
They have to actually action it first. This is just the working groups recommendations and its over to the coalition to decide/in anything to move forward with.
Apparantly many members of the labour party aren't as keen on the idea as they first were
