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@taniwharugby said in The Folau Factor:
They been talking about Maria alot on the Radio this morning...is a tough one for her, given she is entitled to support her husband, she has remained largely quiet on the subject, but since she shared his fundme thing, people have started asking about her views.
This is just the natural progression of the lynch mob.
First it was that he needed to be punished. Then someone calls for him to be fired. Shortly after someone wants to make sure he is never employed again (by trying to have the NRL confirm he would not be registered). Then it becomes about pulling down avenues of funding his right to a hearing in court. After two months the lynch mob are all a bit tired of all that and have figured that they can try and mess with his marriage as well.
It's the very essenence of virtue signalling. "How do I know if you are against bigoted hate speech if you only think he should have been suspended for a month, I think he should be unemployable and his marriage should disintergrate - I must care more".
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@rotated said in The Folau Factor:
@taniwharugby said in The Folau Factor:
They been talking about Maria alot on the Radio this morning...is a tough one for her, given she is entitled to support her husband, she has remained largely quiet on the subject, but since she shared his fundme thing, people have started asking about her views.
This is just the natural progression of the lynch mob.
First it was that he needed to be punished. Then someone calls for him to be fired. Shortly after someone wants to make sure he is never employed again (by trying to have the NRL confirm he would not be registered). Then it becomes about pulling down avenues of funding his right to a hearing in court. After two months the lynch mob are all a bit tired of all that and have figured that they can try and mess with his marriage as well.
It's the very essenence of virtue signalling. "How do I know if you are against bigoted hate speech if you only think he should have been suspended for a month, I think he should be unemployable and his marriage should disintergrate - I must care more".
Aaah! The good old 'let's tar every opposing opinion to mine with an extreme adage ploy'.
It has been a bit more subtle up to now but kudos for coming straight out with it. -
@Crucial said in The Folau Factor:
800,000.00 now
Fucking hell I wake up & I see that Folau has raised A $1,250,000
He's essentially raised DOUBLE the money in HALF the time
I love it
PC Twitter and their Mobs have been played for fools
Exhibit A for the Streisand effect
If you can't raise money from the little guys why not upscale & get bigger donations from anonymous groups
I hope Izzy engages in a scorched strategy & breaks the back of Rugby Australia so they need a bailout from Federal Govn't/Twiggy Forrest
I live for this shit It's going be a ugly in the courtroom Disclosing all correspondence Leaks are going to come from everywhere Lets the games commence
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@Jaguares4real said in The Folau Factor:
@Crucial said in The Folau Factor:
800,000.00 now
Fucking hell I wake up & I see that Folau has raised A $1,250,000
He's essentially raised DOUBLE the money in HALF the time
I love it
PC Twitter and their Mobs have been played for fools
Exhibit A for the Streisand effect
If you can't raise money from the little guys why not upscale & get bigger donations from anonymous groups
I hope Izzy engages in a scorched strategy & breaks the back of Rugby Australia so they need a bailout from Federal Govn't/Twiggy Forrest
I live for this shit It's going be a ugly in the courtroom Disclosing all correspondence Leaks are going to come from everywhere Lets the games commence
If you really believe all that you wrote there rather than acting like a kid at a party with too much red cordial then I truly despair.
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@Crucial said in The Folau Factor:
arty with too much red cordial th
Oh Cordial I believe it betcha
Where have I gone wrong factually....
Money raised in time frame, Streisand Effect, PC Twitter/Mobs
Raising Money from Groups not Joe Public,
Only thing that's subjective is his scorched earth strategy..........
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@Crucial said in The Folau Factor:
@Rembrandt said in The Folau Factor:
@Crucial So he didn't break terms of service. How about that.
https://www.acl.org.au/donate_izzy
$800,000.00 now
As I said (and you choose to ignore) the intention of those terms is not only clear but likely defendable in court. Go fund me is not something anyone is entitled to use, they can do because someone else created it.
You are reading supposed intention, I am reading the exact words. There is no crime or even an alleged crime so he in no way broke the terms. Its pretty black and white.
Others that support the cause have created their own platform now which is their right and freedom. No need to put any blame on the facilitators of go fund me.
I agree, Gofundme can do what they want but we can certainly call them out for their lies and hypocrisy. My concern is when the outrage mob goes then to the next level and targets processors, appstores and banks like they have with other alternative social media and patreon equivalents. Are these platforms or publishers. Following the outrage brigade logic you should have your power switched off for having the wrong opinions, I see this as a very bad thing for society.
Oh, and that score update as if it is a telethon is making you look rather like taking glee in the aspects of bigotry that undoubtedly contribute more to this cause than the political ones.
What me?!
In all seriousness though, it is true getting some glee from the crazies losing their mind over this..imagine thinking stopping gofundme was a victory.... There is certainly some bigotry with religious folk but there is also a hell of a lot of bigotry within the LGBT+ progressive movement. In the 90's and 2000's I criticised the religious right for their outrage mobs, pearl clutching, moral panics, demands for deplatforming and censorship..it seems to me and many others that the shoe now seems to be on the other foot. I don't support Folau's view on homosexuality being a sin but I do sympathise with concerns over the excesses of this movement, if these aren't reigned in I fear we really will see some horrific persecution of the gay community.
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@Jaguares4real I think where you’ve gone wrong is thinking that there will be any winners in this. There won’t, you’ll end up with someone who looks like a reactionary dinosaur and an organisation that looks managerially incompetent. And a load of lawyers buying new boats.
I think you’re also going wrong in using terms like scorched earth. There’s no real malice here, just two sides that believe they’re right. And as with many situations where principle is involved, both parties have said things on the spur of the moment that they probably now regret, as they’ve reduced the opportunities to walk back some of the rhetoric and enable a graceful resolution.
Everybody loses. I’m not sure how that’s particularly entertaining or edifying. But that’s just me.
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@JC said in The Folau Factor:
@Jaguares4real I think where you’ve gone wrong is thinking that there will be any winners in this. There won’t, you’ll end up with someone who looks like a reactionary dinosaur and an organisation that looks managerially incompetent. And a load of lawyers buying new boats.
I think you’re also going wrong in using terms like scorched earth. There’s no real malice here, just two sides that believe they’re right. And as with many situations where principle is involved, both parties have said things on the spur of the moment that they probably now regret, as they’ve reduced the opportunities to walk back some of the rhetoric and enable a graceful resolution.
Everybody loses. I’m not sure how that’s particularly entertaining or edifying. But that’s just me.
I largely agree JC
Whichever side wins, it;ll be a Pyrrhic victory
Don't get where Folau comes off being a reactionary dinosaur
He merely posted a few verses on Instagram & some sermons
You can be against LGBT "Agenda" & not be a bigot It's NOT an binary choice
Sure lawyers will win but that's Standard Practise for the bug cats in the industry
I agree there's no going back & that's why it's so interesting + exciting for me
Things will only get more ugly and nasty as time wears on
Wallabies are going to be in a mess for a while
Folau was a serious player for them & was idolised by many of the younger PI players along with Kepu
They'll be hurting & know they better keep their mouths shut
Keep their religion in the closet Oh the irony
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@Crucial said in The Folau Factor:
Aaah! The good old 'let's tar every opposing opinion to mine with an extreme adage ploy'.
It has been a bit more subtle up to now but kudos for coming straight out with it.This isn't about the opinion of others it's the lengths fringe elements are willing to go to.
How else do you explain those admittedly fringe portions of the anti-Folau crowd now trying to publicly antagonize his wife over privately held opinions and beliefs that she hasn't aired publicly and privately supporting her husband? Pretty gross IMO.
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@barbarian said in The Folau Factor:
If Israel wins with damages (acknowledge it's a big if) then yes I will blame him. How could you not?
I see so many parallels between the Gawker vs Hulk Hogan case that sunk them. Inevitably, like Gawker, the ARU would blame the aggrieved party for having the means and will to bring sustained legal claims against them. But ultimately if the court does find in his favour it will be their hubris and disregard for due process that is what did them in.
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@rotated said in The Folau Factor:
@Crucial said in The Folau Factor:
Aaah! The good old 'let's tar every opposing opinion to mine with an extreme adage ploy'.
It has been a bit more subtle up to now but kudos for coming straight out with it.This isn't about the opinion of others it's the lengths fringe elements are willing to go to.
How else do you explain those admittedly fringe portions of the anti-Folau crowd now trying to publicly antagonize his wife over privately held opinions and beliefs that she hasn't aired publicly and privately supporting her husband? Pretty gross IMO.
I explain them as being dickheads. Quite simple.
However, not all (and probably not even a majority) of those not supporting/against Folau are no where near that extreme or fringe.
You need to stop looking at the extremes and accept that a lot of level headed people also think he is going too far.
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@Crucial said in The Folau Factor:
@rotated said in The Folau Factor:
@Crucial said in The Folau Factor:
Aaah! The good old 'let's tar every opposing opinion to mine with an extreme adage ploy'.
It has been a bit more subtle up to now but kudos for coming straight out with it.This isn't about the opinion of others it's the lengths fringe elements are willing to go to.
How else do you explain those admittedly fringe portions of the anti-Folau crowd now trying to publicly antagonize his wife over privately held opinions and beliefs that she hasn't aired publicly and privately supporting her husband? Pretty gross IMO.
I explain them as being dickheads. Quite simple.
However, not all (and probably not even a majority) of those not supporting/against Folau are no where near that extreme or fringe.
You need to stop looking at the extremes and accept that a lot of level headed people also think he is going too far.
Then those level headed people should do much more to reign in the dickheads. But they often don't because it's not about the principal but the side. Both sides of politics are guilty of it, but right now it's the crazies of the left running wild. That might be difficult to swallow but I don't see how it can be disputed.
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@rotated said in The Folau Factor:
@Crucial said in The Folau Factor:
Aaah! The good old 'let's tar every opposing opinion to mine with an extreme adage ploy'.
It has been a bit more subtle up to now but kudos for coming straight out with it.This isn't about the opinion of others it's the lengths fringe elements are willing to go to.
How else do you explain those admittedly fringe portions of the anti-Folau crowd now trying to publicly antagonize his wife over privately held opinions and beliefs that she hasn't aired publicly and privately supporting her husband? Pretty gross IMO.
Yup, as has been stated this goes way beyond Folau. In fact I'd say his actual comments and beliefs are pretty irrelevant to many that are supporting his court case and/or donating to it.
For many this is a chance to address some growing and worrying trends in recent years with regards to free speech:
- Outrage mobs are getting out of hand. People trying to ruin someone's life for saying the wrong thing is limiting free speech. I've seen examples of people in the UK being doxxed, harrassed, intimidated by police etc because they dared to suggest there is only two genders. Folau's tweet in the greater scheme of things is really not a big deal, this is a massive overreaction from a lot of people.
- Corporations, especially big tech companies and mainstream media outlets, are pushing some very far left ideas and also trying to appease the fringe radicals on social media, again limiting free speech.
This case is a perfect example of both, so people want to see it go all the way to try and draw a bit of a line in the sand; mainly to help protect those less fortunate as Folau should they be on the receiving end of a social and mainstream media lynch mob.
You may say the far left radicals that kick off these mobs are a minority, and you'd be right, but those lunatics have freaking way too much sway in society today.
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I would think that the dollar amount is a big wake-up call to other corporations and businesses sending a message that they’re not going to get away with discrimination in the workplace without a fight on their hands.
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It’s times like this that I feel I need to to remind everyone that the Crusaders will win Super Rugby 2019, the All Blacks World Cup 2019 and Canterbury Mitre 10 Cup 2019.
And all this stuff with the ARU, Folau, gofundme, will be surpassed by celebration and an overwhelming feeling that all is right with the world.
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Anglican Archbishop of Sydney:
{...} Davies said while there are deeply held views on both sides of the issue, “at the moment, only one side is being heard”.
“The way in which Folau’s motives have been impugned and his avenues of support have been cut off smacks of a new and ugly Australia where dissent from narrow cultural views is not tolerated,” he said.
He’s not talking about our Raelene, now is he??
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@JC said in The Folau Factor:
I don’t think you get the point Major. Do you personally spend time with any born again evangelicals? Because if you do I doubt you would say that IF was “having a pop” at anybody. He’s not. He believes (and just to be clear, I don’t) that the Bible is amongst other things an instruction manual that tells everybody how hard it is to get to Heaven and what they need to avoid doing if they don’t want to go to Hell, which are both, it says, real places.
Further, he believes that his God demands that he takes responsibility for helping as many people as he can on the right path to the right place. He believes in “love” and “grace” in the biblical sense and doesn’t see his shepherding people (as he sees it) along a righteous path as an insult, but rather as a favour and a duty. It’s too simple to say he’s having a pop.
Now I think he’s deluded. But I don’t doubt that he believes, in good faith, that he doesn’t have a choice but to speak his truth. And he and his will also believe they are being persecuted for it. If you understand those two things you might realise why he and his supporters will take this all the way.
Well, I don't think I've disagreed with much of that. I've really no idea why you think I do. I'll only say two things.
- Just because Folau doesn't think he's "having a pop" doesn't mean the other side necessarily has to think the same.
- If somebody tells me to "go to hell" in future, despite the ramblings on TSF, I'm still very confident they are trying to offend me. Not that I'll give a shit.
But overall, there's two reasons why I could never support the guy
- He has tattoo's. So he's either hypocritical or chooses which areas of community he think's needs his learnings
- Being gay is a not a choice. Having somebody tell you to choose to become straight in order to achieve a better standard of afterlife is fucked up thinking.
Each to their own.
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I’d say Netball NZ and ANZ handled this fairly well.
{...]
Folau’s wife, the star netball player Maria, shared his plea for funds on her Instagram account but Netball New Zealand on Tuesday confirmed they would not take any action against her as she had not breached any of its policies.
The governing body said it “values inclusion and diversity across all areas of the community and our sport whether its gender, ethnicity, socio economic status, sexuality, religion, and we take responsibility as role models for young New Zealanders very seriously.
“We acknowledge that people have differing views and beliefs. It is important those opinions and views are expressed in constructive and respectful ways.”
ANZ, one of NZN’s major sponsors, said it did not share Maria’s views and that it had made its position known to the organisation.
“ANZ NZ believes in diversity and inclusion,” ANZ spokesman Stefan Herrick said. “But we will continue to support Netball NZ and the tens of thousands of participants and supporters of the game.”
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@Rancid-Schnitzel said in The Folau Factor:
right now it's the crazies of the left running wild. That might be difficult to swallow but I don't see how it can be disputed.
@No-Quarter said in The Folau Factor:
You may say the far left radicals that kick off these mobs are a minority, and you'd be right, but those lunatics have freaking way too much sway in society today.
Really? Some high profile evidence to the contrary below..
Sports requiring athletes to support cultural positions