Coronavirus - New Zealand
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I skimmed through it.
I was hoping for more information on the software behind NCTS. That was the area that was heavily criticised anonymously over the weekend.
Whenever the PM or Bloomfield was questioned about it they pivoted to talking about the organisation of people on the ground. That makes me suspect the source of the problems is the software (and therefore one of the main reasons for the extension L4 extension? We'll find out months later..)
Does anyone have more info?
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@Duluth Yeah I didn't include anything on NCTS as the info was so sketchy. TBF at the time the report was written it had not been operating long.
From what Bloomfield has said NCTS is a very basic package with the ability (& intention) to bolt on other packages, like Singapore's, as and when.
My understanding is that all it really is at the moment is a central database that takes personal info (NHI's addresses etc) from the various DHB Patient management systems and cross references it with other govt db's.
As such it is very simplistic but from my exposure to health information management even achieving this would be quite a mission. Every DHB uses a different PMS - some do have the same one but they also record info within them differently and capture different fields etc.
In theory NZ should have an advantage with health information management as we all have a unique NHI from birth which should allow for really accurate tracking of individuals but this info has never been collated at a national level. So there will be multiple patient files both across and within DHB's. therefore multiple contact details etc.
Then factor in GP records and its a massive overload of conflicting info. Data cleansing this would be a big job but should give a real payback in terms of the speed to track an individual down. That's where I think it's at currently.
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
So there will be multiple patient files both across and within DHB's. therefore multiple contact details etc.
that is somethign that surprised me recently to learn that the information is not shared between DHBs so if you are admitted to any hospital or see a Dr anywhere in NZ they dont have access to your medical records!
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@Godder said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Godder said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
I'd have stuck with this week, but 2 working days and avoiding a bunch of region breaches for the long weekend has some merit. Businesses being allowed to prepare from today for opening is obvious but at least it occurred to someone.
Seems a good reason to avoid yoyos between levels.
I absolutely fucking hated it when JA said "2 working days". What fucking decade is she living in??? Has she spoken to the Queenstown cafes and restaurants that do the vast majority of their trade on the weekend?
And what on earth are the criteria that we didn't meet to achieve 12pm on the 23rd, or that we must meet to hit 12pm on the 27th?
This is so stupid. If people's livelihoods weren't being destroyed, it would acrually be comical.
14 people in hospital. Less than 10 new cases per day. And we are killing the economy.
The Queenstown hospitality sector is going to be in ruins no matter what the government does. That's not to say that every business is going under, but when a region goes from 20,000 people + 3.9 million annual visitors to whatever the current numbers look like, there will be a lot businesses going under.
Likewise hospo in general - take away tourism and throw in a GDP hit, and a lot of the sector is finished. If the margins are so thin that week or two is unsurvivable, maybe the new economy was unsurvivable as well.
bolded textIt was interesting to me that Hospitality NZ thinks this is doom for everyone, while the Restaurant Association think takeaways and delivery should be enough for their members to get through this.
That's a weird one (last paragraph). The two associations aren't representative of exactly the same people as HANZ also represents accommodation providers, but if HANZ intended to speak on behalf of it's restauranteur members, then someone has this blatantly wrong, or grossly over-generalised.
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@dogmeat said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
From what Bloomfield has said NCTS is a very basic package with the ability (& intention) to bolt on other packages, like Singapore's, as and when.
They mentioned a modified Case management system. I'm fairly sure I know which software and it is underwhelming. That was the dinosaur mentioned in the NZH from the weekend
(hmmm actually the NCTS software is not the same as the other crappy software Bloomfield mentioned)I doubt we'll find anything else out until PMQ's returns
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Considering I got a phonecall trying to trace someone on a mobile number I've had for more than 10 years, the data quality must be pretty average.
Also, it comes through as 'anonymous caller' so I didn't pick up the first time. Challenges in the modern world eh
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@nzzp TBF, if it is a person calling it could simply have been a mis-push on the number too, or the person giving them the data has supplied an incorrect number to trace?
But yeah the anonymous caller thing does my head in, most of our major suppliers numbers show as Anonymous, I tend to ignore these unless I am expecting a call, but at least suppliers usually leave a message meaning I call them back, but spammers dont.
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@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@nzzp TBF, if it is a person calling it could simply have been a mis-push on the number too, or the person giving them the data has supplied an incorrect number to trace?
yep, but they phoned twice.
No biggy, but my anecdote (aka lived experience)
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@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@nzzp so yeah either given wrong info by someone, or poor data....
Someone probably transcribed the number into their journal wrong.
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@antipodean cant read thier own writing
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@antipodean said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@nzzp so yeah either given wrong info by someone, or poor data....
Someone probably transcribed the number into their journal wrong.
It’s hard to get good slate these days.
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@shark said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Godder said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@voodoo said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Godder said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
I'd have stuck with this week, but 2 working days and avoiding a bunch of region breaches for the long weekend has some merit. Businesses being allowed to prepare from today for opening is obvious but at least it occurred to someone.
Seems a good reason to avoid yoyos between levels.
I absolutely fucking hated it when JA said "2 working days". What fucking decade is she living in??? Has she spoken to the Queenstown cafes and restaurants that do the vast majority of their trade on the weekend?
And what on earth are the criteria that we didn't meet to achieve 12pm on the 23rd, or that we must meet to hit 12pm on the 27th?
This is so stupid. If people's livelihoods weren't being destroyed, it would acrually be comical.
14 people in hospital. Less than 10 new cases per day. And we are killing the economy.
The Queenstown hospitality sector is going to be in ruins no matter what the government does. That's not to say that every business is going under, but when a region goes from 20,000 people + 3.9 million annual visitors to whatever the current numbers look like, there will be a lot businesses going under.
Likewise hospo in general - take away tourism and throw in a GDP hit, and a lot of the sector is finished. If the margins are so thin that week or two is unsurvivable, maybe the new economy was unsurvivable as well.
bolded textIt was interesting to me that Hospitality NZ thinks this is doom for everyone, while the Restaurant Association think takeaways and delivery should be enough for their members to get through this.
That's a weird one (last paragraph). The two associations aren't representative of exactly the same people as HANZ also represents accommodation providers, but if HANZ intended to speak on behalf of it's restauranteur members, then someone has this blatantly wrong, or grossly over-generalised.
Not necessarily.
The effects will be different for different restaurants depending on a number of factors.Thinking back to my days as a restauranteur and how this would have affected us, I’d say that we would have got through and not even bothered to try and do takeouts.
Your main costs are rent, wages and stock. If you aren’t operating then wages and stock costs are virtually nil. Rent on premises would be down to your lease and IIRC we had one of those section 28(?) clause that said that if we couldn’t access the premises for operating the business then the landlord had to decrease the rent accordingly. Basically we would have gone “on hold” and had to live off reserves but the business would survive.
Of course this is different if you don’t have a interruption clause in your lease (like malls don’t) and if you have salaried employees that you want to keep.
If you arent selling and serving food then two thirds of your costs are gone. It then comes down to if the landlord wants to come out of this with a bunch of empty premises.
There will certainly be businesses that go under but assuming that death awaits all is also not true.
If I was a landlord of a successful restaurant I would first be looking to see how sustainable their model is going to be post Covid and working with them to adjust. -
@Crucial said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
If I was a landlord of a successful restaurant I would first be looking to see how sustainable their model is going to be post Covid and working with them to adjust
and yest soooo many landlords are just "pay me the rent or get the fuck out"
I know of a few business who have already been forced out because they can't afford the rent the landlord refuses to negotiate.
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@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Crucial said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
If I was a landlord of a successful restaurant I would first be looking to see how sustainable their model is going to be post Covid and working with them to adjust
and yest soooo many landlords are just "pay me the rent or get the fuck out"
I know of a few business who have already been forced out because they can't afford the rent the landlord refuses to negotiate.
Real world outcome versus a more optimistic view of how the world works.
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@mariner4life said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@Crucial said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
If I was a landlord of a successful restaurant I would first be looking to see how sustainable their model is going to be post Covid and working with them to adjust
and yest soooo many landlords are just "pay me the rent or get the fuck out"
I know of a few business who have already been forced out because they can't afford the rent the landlord refuses to negotiate.
Yes and that’s unfortunate that they have a dickwad landlord. Hope they make it clear to everyone who they are and to beware dong business with them.
I understand that landlords need rent to cover their costs (and may have pressure from their financers) but good business decisions should rule and flexibility needs to go all along the chain.
In NZ if you use the “standard” business lease agreement there is a clause that ensures that they can’t charge you full if you can’t operate your business due to pandemics and the like (eg earthquakes). The govt has also put an overarching rule in place about evictions.
There will be people caught out though. -
@Donsteppa said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@antipodean said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@taniwharugby said in Coronavirus - New Zealand:
@nzzp so yeah either given wrong info by someone, or poor data....
Someone probably transcribed the number into their journal wrong.
It’s hard to get good slate these days.
papyrus is so much easier