-
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
So throw shit at Biden all you like (as long as it is warranted) but to do so while ignoring Trumps financial connections to a state player is extremely myopic.
Trumps been investigated for 3 year. what was it. A cost of $20 million. And what was found. NOTHING.
I would like the same focus on Biden and his son (and family too). Esp the 1 billion Chinese 'loan' (that a billion not million). And the Hunter Biden Ukraine carry on as well. Maybe its all OK but why would the Chinese give a company linked to Biden son so much money. And would they have given this money if Biden wasn't high up in the US Govt. And who else have they given money to in political office in the US?
Are you believing Trump's ramblings without checking for truth again? That surprises me not.
The Hunter Biden thing with Ukraine has been investigated already and cleared.
Well, cleared in so far as not being able to withstand charges which is exactly what the Russia 'collusion' investigation came to against the Trump campaign.
Trump hasn't been investigated for feathering his nest with China and he also has loans with them. He also directly profits from having a chinese state tenant as one of his biggest. So again, are you applying the same yardstick or working on a 'two wrongs' principle.Factcheck?
I'll repeat. I would like Biden and his family investigated in the same way as Trump has been. And maybe by a group of Republicans (or Biden haters) to make it comparable to the Trump investigation (and I'll repeat. It found NOTHING). Even though mud is still being thrown. But fewer and fewer believe it now.
I think Crucial posted up an article that says he's been investigated cleared. 3 posts ago in fact.... Personally I think they are all dirty
I think he's asking for an over top witchhunt like what Trump had for an even up. Not sure what that would achieve except make discourse even worse.
Which one? I think the Ukraine thing as OTT, but not the Russian election interference.
If you want to claim leadership of the free world those sorts of things need to be investigated thoroughlySure, if you are willing to follow the evidence when it doesn't lead to Trump, which didn't seem to be the case. Without going through it all again, there is evidence that the Russians weren't favouring Trump, they were favoring division and supporting both sides of contentious issues.
Pretty much got what they wanted IMO.
To be honest they didn't have to try very hard
Well no, it's been on this trajectory since Gore sued for losing an election. Social media, etc have made this sort of manipulation easier from outside the country as well, as well as how they have donations that can be made to lobby groups and politicians.
It's a mess.
-
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
@Crucial said in US Politics:
So throw shit at Biden all you like (as long as it is warranted) but to do so while ignoring Trumps financial connections to a state player is extremely myopic.
Trumps been investigated for 3 year. what was it. A cost of $20 million. And what was found. NOTHING.
I would like the same focus on Biden and his son (and family too). Esp the 1 billion Chinese 'loan' (that a billion not million). And the Hunter Biden Ukraine carry on as well. Maybe its all OK but why would the Chinese give a company linked to Biden son so much money. And would they have given this money if Biden wasn't high up in the US Govt. And who else have they given money to in political office in the US?
Are you believing Trump's ramblings without checking for truth again? That surprises me not.
The Hunter Biden thing with Ukraine has been investigated already and cleared.
Well, cleared in so far as not being able to withstand charges which is exactly what the Russia 'collusion' investigation came to against the Trump campaign.
Trump hasn't been investigated for feathering his nest with China and he also has loans with them. He also directly profits from having a chinese state tenant as one of his biggest. So again, are you applying the same yardstick or working on a 'two wrongs' principle.Factcheck?
I'll repeat. I would like Biden and his family investigated in the same way as Trump has been. And maybe by a group of Republicans (or Biden haters) to make it comparable to the Trump investigation (and I'll repeat. It found NOTHING). Even though mud is still being thrown. But fewer and fewer believe it now.
I think Crucial posted up an article that says he's been investigated cleared. 3 posts ago in fact.... Personally I think they are all dirty
I think he's asking for an over top witchhunt like what Trump had for an even up. Not sure what that would achieve except make discourse even worse.
Which one? I think the Ukraine thing as OTT, but not the Russian election interference.
If you want to claim leadership of the free world those sorts of things need to be investigated thoroughlySure, if you are willing to follow the evidence when it doesn't lead to Trump, which didn't seem to be the case. Without going through it all again, there is evidence that the Russians weren't favouring Trump, they were favoring division and supporting both sides of contentious issues.
Pretty much got what they wanted IMO.
Sure did.
The investigation did follow through on “non-Trump” aspects and even made arrests. It was clearly established that there was interference.
They would have been remiss not to look and see if it was encouraged or arranged by the Trump campaign as there were so many connections, lies and contradictions from that avenue.
Remember that the investigation was about interference not setting out to prove collusion, but once information pointed in that direction it had to be looked at.
Putin is a player and is playing short, medium and long term games.
If the US pulls out of Europe, Putin will be laughing his arse off.
All it probably took was a side comment to Trump asking why they spent so much there ( that is all my guessing obviously)Trump saw an opportunity to look like he was doing something for ‘ and has now established a narrative of “not in our interest”
Talk to some experts in the field and they will disagree strongly on that. -
@Crucial said in US Politics:
Can you please explain how it is that you can get so upset about legal (but dodgy) dealings by the Biden’s but totally chose to ignore Trump stretching rules
BDS.
It's the same as TDS mentioned here all the time, but it has a "B".
-
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
The narrative is that Putin got Trump elected. Which is not true, it's more accurate to say Putin poured gasoline on the US political landscape and threw matches everywhere.
Trump was one outcome, BLM riots was another.
I'll agree that is the popular narrative but for me it was all about whether Trump's campaign and cronies tried to take advantage of Putin's desire to interfere.
When you have people like Flynn and Stone lying (or in Flynn's claim now 'lying about lying') and Trump himself trying to obstruct as far as he could get away with, then any investigator doing their job properly would look closely to see how true that was.
Trump lies and his cronies lie. Were their denials to be taken on face value?
To call that a witch hunt and unfair is extremely naive.But yes, Putin is just chucking stuff over the fence and playing Trump like a fiddle. He will surely want him to be re-elected.
Trump has tried to get Ukraine and China to help him against Biden already sending strong messages to Putin. He has been undermining confidence in the electoral system since before being sworn in and there could be one hell of a scary endgame to play out.
I can't remember exactly how it works but it could come down to getting a couple of states to declare no confidence or interference in their ballot and it goes to the House of Reps to declare the winner. The trick is that the House only gets one vote per state on this and that could go in his favour.
All theory of course but nothing would surprise me.
-
Oh it's absolutely a witchhunt, not naive at all to call it such. You are having to cherry pick one investigation, there has been a series of these from the Democrats now.
Everything is dialed up to 11, so it's just become background noise.
I have sane people I know in the US that are honestly concerned that Trump won't give up power if he loses the election. That's how retarded this has all become.
-
@Winger said in US Politics:
I would like the same focus on Biden and his son (and family too).
I find this very odd. Why do you care so much, are you an American voter? I'm somewhat interested in US politics but I don't get why people who aren't US voters are so heavily invested in this. I just watch it the same way I watch overseas rugby games; entertained in principle but generally dismissive of everything about it and certainly not going to get worked up about something that is ultimately of no consequence to me.
-
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
I have sane people I know in the US that are honestly concerned that Trump won't give up power if he loses the election.
Seriously? How does that even play out?
He loses and the military follow the new elected president to enforce "democracy". Even that word is a bit wrong when you have the electoral college.
You're right the whole thing is retarded.
-
@Snowy said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
I have sane people I know in the US that are honestly concerned that Trump won't give up power if he loses the election.
Seriously? How does that even play out?
He loses and the military follow the new elected president to enforce "democracy". Even that word is a bit wrong when you have the electoral college.
You're right the whole thing is retarded.
I try not to go down those sorts of rabbit holes. When they explained the scenerio I just changed the subject. As as much chance of happening as me being cast as Batman.
-
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@Snowy said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
I have sane people I know in the US that are honestly concerned that Trump won't give up power if he loses the election.
Seriously? How does that even play out?
He loses and the military follow the new elected president to enforce "democracy". Even that word is a bit wrong when you have the electoral college.
You're right the whole thing is retarded.
I try not to go down those sorts of rabbit holes. When they explained the scenerio I just changed the subject. As as much chance of happening as me being cast as Batman.
Don't sell yourself short bro
-
I am always astounded at the numbers they get to these poltical rallies, even ones poorly attended...I have never had any inclination to go to one (if they had them here)
Always recall those party political broadcasts as a kid, they suuucked haha
-
@voodoo said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@Snowy said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
I have sane people I know in the US that are honestly concerned that Trump won't give up power if he loses the election.
Seriously? How does that even play out?
He loses and the military follow the new elected president to enforce "democracy". Even that word is a bit wrong when you have the electoral college.
You're right the whole thing is retarded.
I try not to go down those sorts of rabbit holes. When they explained the scenerio I just changed the subject. As as much chance of happening as me being cast as Batman.
Don't sell yourself short bro
*** squints eyes *** This a short joke? If so well done.
-
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
For example;
30 Investigations not feel slightly agenda driven to you?
For a start the number 30 is over-reaching, it includes investigations of associates that have been caught lying under oath on other investigations.
Hard to say if that is much different to the norm. Although Obama didn't have a business under a convoluted structure to investigate and din't have issues with campaign staff breaking laws, he still faced plenty of Congress investigations.
In fact he faced none until the Reps took control of the Senate in 2011 and then was bombarded much like Trump has been. The 'Fast and Furious' cover ups, Solyndra, the Benghazi attacks (which led to the Clinton email server as an offshoot), whether the IRS were instructed to target tea party groups....
Trump likes to claim that he is unfairly targeted but it is pretty much the norm for the incumbent President to be investigated about failings and cover ups.
As for the State and Local government stuff, I am guessing that many of those are offshoots of each other. As one is looked at, further charges arise. There is definitely cause for investigation around his business dealings. FFS the IRS have been investigating him forever.Agenda driven? Maybe some truth to that in how tenacious the investigations are, but no more so than against other presidents.
I will also come back to the fact that Trump publicly lies and expects to get away with it. That is bound to rile up prosecutors no end.
He is hiding behind his position at the moment and is likely to face some massive legal battles when out of office. -
@Snowy said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
I have sane people I know in the US that are honestly concerned that Trump won't give up power if he loses the election.
Seriously? How does that even play out?
He loses and the military follow the new elected president to enforce "democracy". Even that word is a bit wrong when you have the electoral college.
You're right the whole thing is retarded.
I doubt that even Trump would want photos of himself being frogmarched out of the Whitehouse.
-
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@voodoo said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
@Snowy said in US Politics:
@Kirwan said in US Politics:
I have sane people I know in the US that are honestly concerned that Trump won't give up power if he loses the election.
Seriously? How does that even play out?
He loses and the military follow the new elected president to enforce "democracy". Even that word is a bit wrong when you have the electoral college.
You're right the whole thing is retarded.
I try not to go down those sorts of rabbit holes. When they explained the scenerio I just changed the subject. As as much chance of happening as me being cast as Batman.
Don't sell yourself short bro
*** squints eyes *** This a short joke? If so well done.
Ha no, you give me too much credit.
Fucking politics hey.
Maybe it's always been like this and I just haven't paid attention. But we used to be able to laugh at the Italians fighting in parliament, or shake our heads in disbelief at the latest African dictator, or be enraged by China, or laugh mockingly at SA.
Nowadays, who is above mockery? The US is a clusterfuck. Britain has a buffoon and Canada has the master of blackface wokery. Australia has ex-PM's chipping away with self-interest at the fore, citizenship debacles, billionaire miners turned-pollies running campaigns, state elected loonies, and sometimes the only sense coming from the likes of Pauline Hanson!
It's a debacle.
-
@JC said in US Politics:
@Winger said in US Politics:
I would like the same focus on Biden and his son (and family too).
I find this very odd. Why do you care so much, are you an American voter? I'm somewhat interested in US politics but I don't get why people who aren't US voters are so heavily invested in this. I just watch it the same way I watch overseas rugby games; entertained in principle but generally dismissive of everything about it and certainly not going to get worked up about something that is ultimately of no consequence to me.
Yet you're posting on this thread so you do care a little bit.
And globalization does impact on the world. And endless wars. I want an end to both.
And if China is (sort of) bribing US politicians (and this needs to be looked into. Just like Russia was) maybe they are doing it not just with the US. Biden and his family would be a great start to try and see whats going on (it might be all above board. Like Russia was. The big Russian interference finds were nonsense). Maybe Trumps and other US politicians dealing with China can be looked at too. Whether its normal business dealings (Trump has a big business) or more.The inquiry would need to be open and transparent though. And not friends of Biden or China doing it
US Politics