Another attack in London


  • Banned

    @NTA said in Another attack in London:

    @Rancid-Schnitzel not necessarily. We were taking about "mainstream" in the same terms as people think generally about religion. There is a difference in structure that means Reformation (per the Christian church) can't be approached in the same way.

    If the individuals or local groups choose to do something about a loose cannon in their midst, even if they are a noted or respected Imam, it doesn't necessarily create a wave of change. In fact, they're likely to be condemned by the whack jobs halfway around the world.

    Or threatened by wack jobs on the same street...



  • It took 8 minutes for the cops to nail the scum, for all the criticism of the authorities the police did very well there.



  • @Rembrandt said in Another attack in London:

    @Hooroo I guess that is fair enough but are you not concerned at all where this could be leading? I've left the uk now but 3 major attacks in 2 months worries the hell out of me, slightly less so now that my sister has left but I still have many friends there and all I seem to see is huge attempts in politics and media to pretend there isn't an issue which is no where near addressing the problem.

    Honestly I can say it doesn't bother me as much as it doesn't bother me what is happening in many african countries etc.

    It is bad humans acting in a way bad humans act. This will always happen somewhere. That will never stop.

    I can live with that



  • @Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Another attack in London:

    @Hooroo said in Another attack in London:

    I don't care nor think about it as it doesn't affect how I go about my life.

    I am interested in the going ons of the separate attacks etc. But the threads just deteriorate into peoples opions on islam and they are exactly the same threads we see over and over again and end up beig who can shout the loudest

    Turns out one of the victims is a kiwi. .. so you might be effected after all. Know anyone in London from Christchurch?

    There would be more chance at someone being in a car accident in NZ that I would know and I don't worry about car accidents either.



  • @Hooroo said in Another attack in London:

    @Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Another attack in London:

    @Hooroo said in Another attack in London:

    I don't care nor think about it as it doesn't affect how I go about my life.

    I am interested in the going ons of the separate attacks etc. But the threads just deteriorate into peoples opions on islam and they are exactly the same threads we see over and over again and end up beig who can shout the loudest

    Turns out one of the victims is a kiwi. .. so you might be effected after all. Know anyone in London from Christchurch?

    There would be more chance at someone being in a car accident in NZ that I would know and I don't worry about car accidents either.

    Worry is a different issue. Didnt you say they don't effect you?
    The specific attacks don't worry me either. I just assume nobody I know will be involved.



  • @Rembrandt said in Another attack in London:

    Great to see the actual mention of evil Islamist extremism, hopefully media can follow suit. Good speech I thought. UK would be idiots to go to Corbyn now

    This bothers me if it isn't done correctly.
    The UK had already bought in rafts of hate speech and terror laws.. and they used by the authorities to harass people over rubbish bins and attack people like Tommy Robinson. These laws usually attack people for Islamophobia! Screw more of that. Any new laws have to be against religious extremists. ..and a list of religions covered attached. At this time just Islam. .. but if Jews, Christians conduct multiple attacks in the UK they can be added to. Islam can be taken off after 15 years of no attacks.
    I fear any new laws will just make the UK closer to a police state. This is an Islamic extremist issue.... not a hate speech issue.



  • @Hooroo said in Another attack in London:

    @Rembrandt said in Another attack in London:

    @Hooroo I guess that is fair enough but are you not concerned at all where this could be leading? I've left the uk now but 3 major attacks in 2 months worries the hell out of me, slightly less so now that my sister has left but I still have many friends there and all I seem to see is huge attempts in politics and media to pretend there isn't an issue which is no where near addressing the problem.

    Honestly I can say it doesn't bother me as much as it doesn't bother me what is happening in many african countries etc.

    It is bad humans acting in a way bad humans act. This will always happen somewhere. That will never stop.

    I can live with that

    Fair enough, I doubt there's much anyone can say to convince you otherwise. I would say though that as these attacks are acts of terrorism - I.E. the use of violence/force to push an ideology with political aims - they are quite a bit more serious then the odd bad egg or random car accidents. Thanks to countries like Saudi Arabia pumping billions of dollars into spreading this, and the wests appeasement to Islam, it is spreading to more and more countries. I'd say someone detonating themselves and blowing hundreds of people to bits at a rugby game in NZ is something we desperately want to avoid.



  • @Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Another attack in London:

    @Hooroo said in Another attack in London:

    @Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Another attack in London:

    @Hooroo said in Another attack in London:

    I don't care nor think about it as it doesn't affect how I go about my life.

    I am interested in the going ons of the separate attacks etc. But the threads just deteriorate into peoples opions on islam and they are exactly the same threads we see over and over again and end up beig who can shout the loudest

    Turns out one of the victims is a kiwi. .. so you might be effected after all. Know anyone in London from Christchurch?

    There would be more chance at someone being in a car accident in NZ that I would know and I don't worry about car accidents either.

    Worry is a different issue. Didnt you say they don't effect you?
    The specific attacks don't worry me either. I just assume nobody I know will be involved.

    I'm not splitting my meanings for the sake of interent talk. If you don't get what I mean then all good.

    It doesn't effect, worry, bother, cause issue with, me. THe only time I see it is in the odd headline and constantly in Off Topic on here.



  • @No-Quarter said in Another attack in London:

    @Hooroo said in Another attack in London:

    @Rembrandt said in Another attack in London:

    @Hooroo I guess that is fair enough but are you not concerned at all where this could be leading? I've left the uk now but 3 major attacks in 2 months worries the hell out of me, slightly less so now that my sister has left but I still have many friends there and all I seem to see is huge attempts in politics and media to pretend there isn't an issue which is no where near addressing the problem.

    Honestly I can say it doesn't bother me as much as it doesn't bother me what is happening in many african countries etc.

    It is bad humans acting in a way bad humans act. This will always happen somewhere. That will never stop.

    I can live with that

    Fair enough, I doubt there's much anyone can say to convince you otherwise. I would say though that as these attacks are acts of terrorism - I.E. the use of violence/force to push an ideology with political aims - they are quite a bit more serious then the odd bad egg or random car accidents. Thanks to countries like Saudi Arabia pumping billions of dollars into spreading this, and the wests appeasement to Islam, it is spreading to more and more countries. I'd say someone detonating themselves and blowing hundreds of people to bits at a rugby game in NZ is something we desperately want to avoid.

    THere are many things we want to avoid. I think we should concern ourselves with gangs and crime etc. That gets less coverage over here than an incedent on the other side of the world



  • An article from the Spectator published today:

    How to tackle the terrorist threat: four steps we must now consider

    James Forsyth

    For the second time in this election, political campaigning is suspended because of a terrorist attack. Given the volume of terrorist attacks—three in the last three months and five other plots disrupted—you might think that the issue would have dominated the campaign. But it hasn’t. Until Theresa May’s statement today talking about how there has been too much tolerance for extremism, there has been remarkably little discussion about how this country should deal with this problem.

    Now, you can say that we shouldn’t allow the terrorists to set the agenda. But I fear that the main reason for the absence of debate is that no one is quite sure what to do. However, it is imperative that we start talking seriously about the steps we can take. This problem isn’t going away and, as the Prime Minister acknowledged this morning, it is currently getting worse.

    There are those talking about internment. I think this is a flawed idea, and one that won’t work. But there are things we need to do. Ideologically we need to accept that these terrorists believe that they find justifications for their action in their faith, and saying that the attacks have nothing to do with Islam is actually counter-productive. As the historian Tom Holland has pointed out, only once we appreciate this link and the fact there is schism within Islam can we start to really deal with this threat.

    Then, we need to consider whether leaving the UK for certain states that have a particular terrorist problem, for example Libya, should require an exit visa. We don’t yet know whether the London Bridge attackers have links with any other countries. But we know that the Manchester attacker went to Libya multiple times and the New York Times is reporting that he used these visits to meet with Islamic State commanders. Exit visas would make it easier for the security services to keep an eye on these kind of trips and to arrest anyone who went to these places without permission and charge them with an imprisonable criminal offence.

    We also need to consider whether we need Singapore-style rules to prevent public housing from becoming racial or religious ghettoes. In diverse towns and cities, is it really sensible to have estates that are made up almost exclusively of people from one ethnic or faith group? By this logic, I wonder if we should pause before allowing faith schools to be made up solely of pupils of that faith.

    We need to be having a public debate about whether we need an Islamic version of the Maynooth Grant, the money the British state sent to the Maynooth seminary in Ireland in the 19th century to create a cadre of Roman Catholic priests who were more sympathetic to the British state. A modern-day Maynooth Grant would help foster a British version of Islam, one that is more easily compatible with our society. If we go down this road, it should be accompanied by a tightening of the rules on foreign funding of religious institutions in Britain and on preachers coming here from abroad.

    The answers to the terrorist problem we face aren’t simple. This isn’t about foreign policy, it is about the hatred a small—but significant—number of Islamists have for the very basis of our society. Tackling it won’t be simple. But ignoring the problem isn’t going to solve it. So, as a matter of urgency, we need to start having a grown-up–and frank–debate about what we are going to do.



  • CNN caught staging news!
    They even brought "peace group" printed out papers and props. https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2017/06/04/british-media-cnni-caught-on-video-staging-politically-correct-propaganda/



  • @Rembrandt
    She's a follower. She should have taken a stand when it was obvious - as in years ago.



  • @Tim very good article, and I think postmodernism spreading through Univerisities and wider society is also adding to the problem as they share a common goal with ISIS in terms of undermining western democracy. Those two in combination have led us to where we are today.



  • @Hooroo Sometimes I wish I could have that state of mind, it would certainly make me a happier individual. The way I feel is if we don't do something now what will the world look like in 5, 10, 15 years? In my mind since I see a real problem I owe it to the next generation to at least try and address it.


  • Banned

    @Pot-Hale said in Another attack in London:

    @Rembrandt said in Another attack in London:

    @antipodean Sickening isn't it. I guess they just want to avoid having egg on their face when its discovered that the terrorists were really white football hooligans right?

    Weak and pathetic.

    Tommy Robinson (who isn't known to pull punches) makes a great point as to what will happen if the authorities don't actually do something people will start taking things into their own hands then you'll really have an extremist problem.

    That's quite a detailed rant from Tommy Robinson. His proposed solution of internment borrowed from the Troubles in Northern Ireland would give me pause for thought however.

    I'm old enough to have grown up during the war in Northern Ireland and seen the effect it had on people on both sides of the divide. There was plenty of internment of people - from both Republican and Loyalist/Unionst factions. I'm not sure how successful a policy it was though. It brought like-minded people together into the one space, and guarded by their 'oppressors', fostered further hatred/opposition and deferred attempts at bringing about a long-term peaceful solution.

    Robinson contends that if the British Govt do nothing then homegrown militias will emerge to take the law into their own hands - and again he draws a parallel with NI on this - presumably making reference to some of the 'murder gangs' that were created within communities. He fails to acknowledge that the British Army had already been dispatched onto the streets in the late sixties/early seventies - initially to protect Catholic communities - and then found themselves fighting people within them. If Britain were to become like NI in the seventies and eighties with troops deployed actively on the streets on a daily basis, patrolling and supporting the police (who would then be armed like the RUC were), what would ordinary Britons make of life then? Or attempting to 'intern' a cohort of some 3,500-4,00o suspected people, what does someone like Robinson think will be the intended and unintended consequences of that policy?

    For all that, I understand his frustration. These are dangerous times without doubt. And that danger is getting closer and closer to all of our streets and front doors.

    The US did something similar Iraq and inadvertently created ISIS. Putting all the bad eggs in one basket never proves to be a particularly smart tactic.

    What frightens me is his claim that 9,000 plus people were arrested on suspicion of terrorism related activities. That's an astonishing number and even if 1/10th of those suspects actually intended to carry out attacks, that would be carnage on a massive scale.

    PM May talks about"enough is enough", but what more can she do? The numbers are ridiculous and the claims that this is nothing more than a couple of mentally challenged lone wolves have been proven to be absolute bollocks. I can't see any solution until there is some meaningful reform within Islam, but that will never happen, and if it does there will probably be a massive schism that puts the Sunni-Shia thing to shame. Ultimately though, it's other Muslims who are by far the biggest victims of this extremism. The fact that we will have to live with it like they do absolutely sickens me.



  • @Frank Agree but considering the other option she is all we have.



  • @Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Another attack in London:

    @Rembrandt said in Another attack in London:

    Great to see the actual mention of evil Islamist extremism, hopefully media can follow suit. Good speech I thought. UK would be idiots to go to Corbyn now

    This bothers me if it isn't done correctly.
    The UK had already bought in rafts of hate speech and terror laws.. and they used by the authorities to harass people over rubbish bins and attack people like Tommy Robinson. These laws usually attack people for Islamophobia! Screw more of that. Any new laws have to be against religious extremists. ..and a list of religions covered attached. At this time just Islam. .. but if Jews, Christians conduct multiple attacks in the UK they can be added to. Islam can be taken off after 15 years of no attacks.
    I fear any new laws will just make the UK closer to a police state. This is an Islamic extremist issue.... not a hate speech issue.

    That is the great worry alright. And although your idea might be more effective we will need to be in a position of daily deadly terrorist attacks for it even to be considered and even then there would be huge opposition to it. I think it is a step in the right direction for May and there is no other even slightly viable alternative in this election.



  • @Tim said in Another attack in London:

    An article from the Spectator published today:

    How to tackle the terrorist threat: four steps we must now consider

    James Forsyth

    For the second time in this election, political campaigning is suspended because of a terrorist attack. Given the volume of terrorist attacks—three in the last three months and five other plots disrupted—you might think that the issue would have dominated the campaign. But it hasn’t. Until Theresa May’s statement today talking about how there has been too much tolerance for extremism, there has been remarkably little discussion about how this country should deal with this problem.

    Now, you can say that we shouldn’t allow the terrorists to set the agenda. But I fear that the main reason for the absence of debate is that no one is quite sure what to do. However, it is imperative that we start talking seriously about the steps we can take. This problem isn’t going away and, as the Prime Minister acknowledged this morning, it is currently getting worse.

    There are those talking about internment. I think this is a flawed idea, and one that won’t work. But there are things we need to do. Ideologically we need to accept that these terrorists believe that they find justifications for their action in their faith, and saying that the attacks have nothing to do with Islam is actually counter-productive. As the historian Tom Holland has pointed out, only once we appreciate this link and the fact there is schism within Islam can we start to really deal with this threat.

    Then, we need to consider whether leaving the UK for certain states that have a particular terrorist problem, for example Libya, should require an exit visa. We don’t yet know whether the London Bridge attackers have links with any other countries. But we know that the Manchester attacker went to Libya multiple times and the New York Times is reporting that he used these visits to meet with Islamic State commanders. Exit visas would make it easier for the security services to keep an eye on these kind of trips and to arrest anyone who went to these places without permission and charge them with an imprisonable criminal offence.

    We also need to consider whether we need Singapore-style rules to prevent public housing from becoming racial or religious ghettoes. In diverse towns and cities, is it really sensible to have estates that are made up almost exclusively of people from one ethnic or faith group? By this logic, I wonder if we should pause before allowing faith schools to be made up solely of pupils of that faith.

    We need to be having a public debate about whether we need an Islamic version of the Maynooth Grant, the money the British state sent to the Maynooth seminary in Ireland in the 19th century to create a cadre of Roman Catholic priests who were more sympathetic to the British state. A modern-day Maynooth Grant would help foster a British version of Islam, one that is more easily compatible with our society. If we go down this road, it should be accompanied by a tightening of the rules on foreign funding of religious institutions in Britain and on preachers coming here from abroad.

    The answers to the terrorist problem we face aren’t simple. This isn’t about foreign policy, it is about the hatred a small—but significant—number of Islamists have for the very basis of our society. Tackling it won’t be simple. But ignoring the problem isn’t going to solve it. So, as a matter of urgency, we need to start having a grown-up–and frank–debate about what we are going to do.

    Hmmm.

    There's a certain amount of irony in British commentators finding parallels and potential solutions to IsIs through its historical experiences in Ireland. The Maynooth Grant resulted in the largest growth in anti-Irish prejudice, commentary and behaviours when it was proposed in Britain. True, the British govt took over the grant to stem the flow of Irish seminarians going to France to become revolutionaries, but the British state providing support for the Catholic Church gave rise to massive outrage and protests from many Protestants, and Orange Order unionists in particular. How that outrage might find form in modern times ('appeasing the terrorists') is something to consider.

    In addition, it may have quelled problems in England with its conflicts elsewhere, but it is also may have helped fan the flames of religious hatred and division in Ireland between north-east and south.



  • Not sure if working.....
    0_1496624049679_upload-dc412b0b-c1e6-45e2-99bb-5fd4c1b9b4c2



  • @Tim

    Re: "There are no easy answers, etc." Of course. But Scott Adams has an interesting hot take. I like it. "Change the frame."

    Helping The Terrorists Recruit

    There is more terrorism in the news, this time in London. So how do the British politicians respond?

    They do a recruitment ad for more terrorists.

    They start by giving the terrorists cool labels, such as “Islamic extremists.” Do you know what sounds like an awesome club for an angry young Muslim to join? I’m thinking “Islamic Extremist” sound about right. That branding should be great for recruitment.

    The media also helps terror recruitment with their wall-to-wall news about the terrorists’ successes. Every time they mention the body count, the bad guys cheer.

    A better approach for the media, if they want to be helpful, might involve inviting a continuous line of Muslim scholars and critics to talk about how these “gullible losers” were duped by ISIS to kill themselves and spend eternity in Hell. And we need lots of visual and other persuasion about Hell. I want Photoshopped images of the terrorists burning for eternity. I want descriptions of the smells, tastes, and sounds they are experiencing, so the next “lone wolf” has something to contrast with the 72 virgin story. Let’s put some doubt into that mix. Fear is a good persuader.

    I also wonder why the families of terrorists are not being flooded with condolence messages from Muslim clerics saying they are sorry about their kid burning in Hell for eternity. Be sincere about it. Include some digital representation of Hell in those cards and letters.

    Change the frame.

    http://blog.dilbert.com/post/161427038341/helping-the-terrorists-recruit



  • @Rembrandt said in Another attack in London:

    @Hooroo Sometimes I wish I could have that state of mind, it would certainly make me a happier individual. The way I feel is if we don't do something now what will the world look like in 5, 10, 15 years? In my mind since I see a real problem I owe it to the next generation to at least try and address it.

    I think it will eventually run its course of destruction and then something heavier and more destructive will come along and IS will be a thing of history.

    A massive virus or bug could decimate a large percentage of the population of this planet as well? I'm not overly concerned about that.

    I am kind of the opinion that if we just all get on with our own lives and keep our sticky beaks out of oithers business you can live a happy and more fulfilling life.



  • Was the Fern down because we were on the verge of solving the ISIS problem?



  • @Hooroo said in Another attack in London:

    @Rembrandt said in Another attack in London:

    @Hooroo Sometimes I wish I could have that state of mind, it would certainly make me a happier individual. The way I feel is if we don't do something now what will the world look like in 5, 10, 15 years? In my mind since I see a real problem I owe it to the next generation to at least try and address it.

    I am kind of the opinion that if we just all get on with our own lives and keep our sticky beaks out of oithers business you can live a happy and more fulfilling life.

    For sure, no doubt that's exactly what the kids going to the Ariana Grande concert were doing.



  • I'm going to steer clear of the Islam discussion here and just make an observation on how this affects life in London.
    Quite obviously it is a big city and you have to be pretty unlucky to be wrong time, wrong place and get caught up in this shit. I guess where this one made me a little more wary is that for me this was only wrong time. last Saturday I was sitting in the spot where the fuckwits eventually got gunned down and earlier on Saturday my son and his girlfriend had discussed heading there that night.
    Still, timing is everything eh?
    I still feel safer here now than I did in the late 80s though, mainly because of the way these idiots operate which at least still gives you a chance even if the time/place equation happens. The old IRA bombs were far more scary.



  • @Frank said in Another attack in London:

    Was the Fern down because we were on the verge of solving the ISIS problem?

    Problem? What problem?

    http://www.thesilverfern.com/topic/1684/forum-software-update/10



  • @Hooroo I genuinely hope you're right, my worry is that you're not and a group passivity to this until it effects us personally may lead to action far too late.

    Footage of radicalisation in islamic schools and mosques is pretty unnerving when you start to consider the numbers involved and the lack of action currently in place. I'm sure NZ won't feel the effects for a long time. Aussie will be sooner, one on right now in melbourne if early reports are to be believed.



  • Interesting.



  • @Godder I have literally no idea what this means. I thought the Saudis were the bad guys. Certainly doesn't bode well for football world cup.





  • @Crucial said in Another attack in London:

    I'm going to steer clear of the Islam discussion here and just make an observation on how this affects life in London.
    Quite obviously it is a big city and you have to be pretty unlucky to be wrong time, wrong place and get caught up in this shit. I guess where this one made me a little more wary is that for me this was only wrong time. last Saturday I was sitting in the spot where the fuckwits eventually got gunned down and earlier on Saturday my son and his girlfriend had discussed heading there that night.
    Still, timing is everything eh?
    I still feel safer here now than I did in the late 80s though, mainly because of the way these idiots operate which at least still gives you a chance even if the time/place equation happens. The old IRA bombs were far more scary.

    How were the IRA bomb far more scary??



  • @Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Another attack in London:

    @Crucial said in Another attack in London:

    I'm going to steer clear of the Islam discussion here and just make an observation on how this affects life in London.
    Quite obviously it is a big city and you have to be pretty unlucky to be wrong time, wrong place and get caught up in this shit. I guess where this one made me a little more wary is that for me this was only wrong time. last Saturday I was sitting in the spot where the fuckwits eventually got gunned down and earlier on Saturday my son and his girlfriend had discussed heading there that night.
    Still, timing is everything eh?
    I still feel safer here now than I did in the late 80s though, mainly because of the way these idiots operate which at least still gives you a chance even if the time/place equation happens. The old IRA bombs were far more scary.

    How were the IRA bomb far more scary??

    Because they scared me more?

    I seem to remember everyone being on edge from threats, certainly you tried to get in and out of tube and rail stations quickly. The threats were vocal more than actual until after I left London but what had been expected finally did come.

    At the moment I am more wary of the hammer wielding scooter thugs that just target people from behind in packs. They are a scourge.



  • @Crucial said in Another attack in London:

    @Baron-Silas-Greenback said in Another attack in London:

    @Crucial said in Another attack in London:

    I'm going to steer clear of the Islam discussion here and just make an observation on how this affects life in London.
    Quite obviously it is a big city and you have to be pretty unlucky to be wrong time, wrong place and get caught up in this shit. I guess where this one made me a little more wary is that for me this was only wrong time. last Saturday I was sitting in the spot where the fuckwits eventually got gunned down and earlier on Saturday my son and his girlfriend had discussed heading there that night.
    Still, timing is everything eh?
    I still feel safer here now than I did in the late 80s though, mainly because of the way these idiots operate which at least still gives you a chance even if the time/place equation happens. The old IRA bombs were far more scary.

    How were the IRA bomb far more scary??

    Because they scared me more?

    I seem to remember everyone being on edge from threats, certainly you tried to get in and out of tube and rail stations quickly. The threats were vocal more than actual until after I left London but what had been expected finally did come.

    At the moment I am more wary of the hammer wielding scooter thugs that just target people from behind in packs. They are a scourge.

    The IRA called it's bombs, had far fewer serious attacks, fewer active members and killed less.
    No way were they more scary.
    And yes I lived in London during both times as well. Actual IRA and Islamic attacks on travel routes I used. The IRA attack onpy killed people because the bomber got his bomb clock wrong by 12 hours...
    The Islamists got theirs exactly right.
    As for soccer thugs.. what is their death toll against innocents so far this year. Must have missed there last murderous rampage against innocent children.

    And what exact chance did the little 8 year old girl in Manchester have against that bomb?


  • Banned

    Why announce you want to avoid discussing Islam and then say that the IRA scared you more? Seriously wtf does the IRA have to do with any of this? Seems to be some kind of weird deflection and argument that these guys really aren't that bad.



  • FFS both of you. I was making a personal comment and observation about how I feel as someone living here. I was NOT trying to downplay anything or overstate something else. It is totally subjective and arguing against me does not and cannot change how I felt in the late 80s/early 90s or how I feel now.

    and @Baron-Silas-Greenback, it's scooter thugs I mentioned, not soccer thugs. No they haven't killed anyway but they are randomly attacking people daily throughout the city.


  • Banned

    @Crucial said in Another attack in London:

    FFS both of you. I was making a personal comment and observation about how I feel as someone living here. I was NOT trying to downplay anything or overstate something else. It is totally subjective and arguing against me does not and cannot change how I felt in the late 80s/early 90s or how I feel now.

    and @Baron-Silas-Greenback, it's scooter thugs I mentioned, not soccer thugs. No they haven't killed anyway but they are randomly attacking people daily throughout the city.

    Then why even mention the IRA or any other form of violence. How on earth is that relevant in this discussion other than being an attempt to downplay what just happened?



  • @Crucial said in Another attack in London:

    FFS both of you. I was making a personal comment and observation about how I feel as someone living here. I was NOT trying to downplay anything or overstate something else. It is totally subjective and arguing against me does not and cannot change how I felt in the late 80s/early 90s or how I feel now.

    and @Baron-Silas-Greenback, it's scooter thugs I mentioned, not soccer thugs. No they haven't killed anyway but they are randomly attacking people daily throughout the city.

    FFS right back at you. I was giving my opinion and questioning the validity and basis for yours.
    You can have your opinion and others can question and say your opinion is wrong.
    My opinion is that saying IRA bombs were more scary is laughable.
    And scooter thugs? Get back to me when the death toll on innocents reaches the thousands. Until then it is a diversion tactic.



  • I was scared by both the IRA and Islamic terrorists while I lived in London.

    Have to agree with BSG though, the IRA didn't target civilians in the same way these Islamists do. Something very visceral and terrifying about running around with 12 inch blades stabbing and slashing random people. Not to mention blowing up eight year old girls.

    Not sure a phoned in bomb threat and a controlled detonation by the police has the same effect.



  • The republican terrorist attacks were very scary, they were constant and went on for years. I can easily see why @Crucial feels the way he does. As an example, in 1974 there were 9 defined terrorist attacks in the UK related to republicanism. 6 in mainland UK. Note this does not take into account kidnappings, kneecappings and murders. Some of the attacks were absolutely horrifying, many were less so but the threat was always there. Very sensible to be scared. Anyone remember the removal of litter bins in London to reduce places where bombs could be hidden?

    Do the attacks themselves bear comparison with the current situation? IMO not really. They were not as totally indiscriminate or irrational and of course with the addition of willing suicide to obtain 72 raisins there is the sense of "How the fuck can we legislate for these fluffybunnies?"

    Both times are scary but we are dealing with two different mindsets. Though I doubt that is relevant to anyone that has been killed by either faction.



  • This post is deleted!

  • Banned

    Just read that one of the guys who filmed while the attacks were taking place chided another person for yelling "fucking Muslim fluffybunnies" while he was filming. Doesn't that just say everything.


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