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the US really does just seem too divided, in lots of different ways, to really "work" anymore
i did some reading a while back, lots of different theories on how the US should be split up into different countries that wold theoretically work better, obviously all fantasy stuff but interesting
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@Crucial
I accept that to a certain extent.
But I think it is still is far out of proportion.
Severed heads of the President, plays depicting him being assassinated, threatening to blow (in jest) up the White House.........
Perhaps some of that can be explained by the virtue signalling Hollywood trying to outdo one another. -
@Kiwiwomble said in US Politics:
the US really does just seem too divided, in lots of different ways, to really "work" anymore
i did some reading a while back, lots of different theories on how the US should be split up into different countries that wold theoretically work better, obviously all fantasy stuff but interesting
They’ve always been divided.
The Mason-Dixon Line is a clear divider for many.
However they have also seen some benefits in joining at a federal level.
I doubt you could create geographical divisions that would not have the same ideological problems -
Here is some classic Joe , at least this election might be entertaining , anyone else find it weird out of 330 million people, it comes down to these two ?
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@kiwiinmelb I know right? This is the country that built the Hoover Dam, sent men to the Moon, built a fighter plane that is invisible to radar. And the best they can do is choose someone to lead the country from these two scrubs??!!!
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@Frank said in US Politics:
@Crucial
I accept that to a certain extent.
But I think it is still is far out of proportion.
Severed heads of the President, plays depicting him being assassinated, threatening to blow (in jest) up the White House.........
Perhaps some of that can be explained by the virtue signalling Hollywood trying to outdo one another.It's worse than it's ever been, but it's not necessarily a Trump/Democrats thing. It's just a continuation of a 25+ year trend.
The left/Dems did it to GWB, and then the right/GOP did it a bit worse to Obama (birther controversy being a decent example). So the left/Dems go harder at Trump.
It's worrying for whoever comes next, whether it's four more years of Trump or a new Biden/Harris regime. As we have said many times on this thread, the whole system is broken.
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@Crucial
Trump's falsehoods are probably no worse than say JFK, Nixon or Lyndon Johnson but he does seem to openly revel in them. As for bullying, he's a rank amatuer compared to the likes of Lyndon Johnson. But equally, I can't recall a President who has been subjected to such constant and caustic attack - almost hatred - by his opponents and the media from day one.Check out how the media doctored video of Trump feeding the fish in Japan or his opponents attacked his mis-reported Charlottesville comments. If Trump's such a unique liar and deliberately divisive, what does this say of his opponents and their motivations?
Should he have tried to rise above it? Absolutely yes. Has he attempted leadership during Coronaviris crisis? No. I'm def not a Trump fan but to mainly blame him for the current state of US politics or think his departure or replacement is going to improve things is to me, just simplistic.
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@barbarian said in US Politics:
The left/Dems did it to GWB, and then the right/GOP did it a bit worse to Obama (birther controversy being a decent example). So the left/Dems go harder at Trump.
Bill Clinton was equally subjected to some pretty sustained and distasteful attacks.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@Crucial
Trump's falsehoods are probably no worse than say JFK, Nixon or Lyndon Johnson but he does seem to openly revel in them. As for bullying, he's a rank amatuer compared to the likes of Lyndon Johnson. But equally, I can't recall a President who has been subjected to such constant and caustic attack - almost hatred - by his opponents and the media from day one.Check out how the media doctored video of Trump feeding the fish in Japan or his opponents attacked his mis-reported Charlottesville comments. If Trump's such a unique liar and deliberately divisive, what does this say of his opponents and their motivations?
Should he have tried to rise above it? Absolutely yes. Has he attempted leadership during Coronaviris crisis? No. I'm def not a Trump fan but to mainly blame him for the current state of US politics or think his departure or replacement is going to improve things is to me, just simplistic.
Bit of a misrepresentation of what I was saying.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@Crucial
... As for bullying, he's a rank amatuer compared to the likes of Lyndon Johnson...True but I think this very amateurishness makes it seem so much worse. Johnson was a bully behind closed doors to the people around him. Trump just lashes out wholesale and in such a petty manner. It's the old sales saying, throw enough mud and some will stick.
I agree though with what some have said, he is not to blame so much for the current state of US politics but he is certainly a symptom of it.
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@Catogrande said in US Politics:
True but I think this very amateurishness makes it seem so much worse.
Yeah, good point. I can't make up my mind if it's deliberate and amateurish or just who he is.
Johnson was a bully behind closed doors to the people around him.
He was similar to Trump in his treatment of the press. Used to say at press conferences that certain reporters were in a room as he could smell them. Difference was he and the Republicans were willing to work together.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@Crucial
Trump's falsehoods are probably no worse than say JFK, Nixon or Lyndon Johnson but he does seem to openly revel in them. As for bullying, he's a rank amatuer compared to the likes of Lyndon Johnson. But equally, I can't recall a President who has been subjected to such constant and caustic attack - almost hatred - by his opponents and the media from day one.Check out how the media doctored video of Trump feeding the fish in Japan or his opponents attacked his mis-reported Charlottesville comments. If Trump's such a unique liar and deliberately divisive, what does this say of his opponents and their motivations?
Should he have tried to rise above it? Absolutely yes. Has he attempted leadership during Coronaviris crisis? No. I'm def not a Trump fan but to mainly blame him for the current state of US politics or think his departure or replacement is going to improve things is to me, just simplistic.
Double like!
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@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@Catogrande said in US Politics:
True but I think this very amateurishness makes it seem so much worse.
Yeah, good point. I can't make up my mind if it's deliberate and amateurish or just who he is.
Johnson was a bully behind closed doors to the people around him.
He was similar to Trump in his treatment of the press. Used to say at press conferences that certain reporters were in a room as he could smell them. Difference was he and the Republicans were willing to work together.
Given Trump doesn’t subscribe to globalisation and climate change, etc. orthodoxy, the Democratic anti-Nation elite was hardly going to cooperate!
And diametrically opposed values to the heavily left leaning MSM.
It does seem POTUS is very deal orientated, so it doesn’t come naturally to put his best foot forward.
Meanwhile, ‘amateur’ approach seems more effective in Middle East than that of the urbane Obama.
The swing to politicians who are seen as doers rather than talkers seems a global phenomenon.
But the personal qualities of such leave a lot to be desired.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@reprobate said in US Politics:
What's Kamala like on law and order?
She's not white and she's not male. Querying her policies, therefore, is probably regarded as racist and sexist.....
She's strong on that, she was a prosecutor and the Californian Attorney-General before she was elected as Senator.
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@Godder said in US Politics:
@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@reprobate said in US Politics:
What's Kamala like on law and order?
She's not white and she's not male. Querying her policies, therefore, is probably regarded as racist and sexist.....
She's strong on that, she was a prosecutor and the Californian Attorney-General before she was elected as Senator.
They need her to come out now and be the hard voice. They might lose a few voters, but it would really help with the suburban housewives in Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, etc.
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@pakman said in US Politics:
Meanwhile, ‘amateur’ approach seems more effective in Middle East than that of the urbane Obama.
To be fair, anyone would be more effective than Obama on foreign policy.
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@Victor-Meldrew Wonder how he'd have gone with today's mainstream and social media intensity?
Certainly wouldn't have come out better
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@gt12 said in US Politics:
@Godder said in US Politics:
@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@reprobate said in US Politics:
What's Kamala like on law and order?
She's not white and she's not male. Querying her policies, therefore, is probably regarded as racist and sexist.....
She's strong on that, she was a prosecutor and the Californian Attorney-General before she was elected as Senator.
They need her to come out now and be the hard voice. They might lose a few voters, but it would really help with the suburban housewives in Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, etc.
Black voters not happy that she was hard on black criminals.
Go figure.
US Politics