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Catogrande

The volte-face of the Germans in downgrading the status of the Syrian refugees will likely turn out to be irrelevant. So they have to leave after two years instead of three? Where are they going to go? How are they going to be transported? (Please no-one say cattle trucks). How will they all be found and identified? The logistics are enormous. It took an awful lot of organisation in letting them in when both sides were working to the same aim - what chance do you give it when one side are dead set against it?
 
Three years was bollocks anyway, 2 years is just further bollocks with a sugar coating for the German electorate. The family reunion thing might (small might) have some traction, but you can bet your last penny that any attempts to block such things will be held up as a transgression of their human rights etc etc.
 
Nope. They are fucked on this one.

gollum

UK has (apparently) 40,000 failed asylym seekers that were told to leave but haven't & now no one actually knows where they are... once you are in you are in.
 
Plus if you fail you just go try knock someone up, then you cannot be deported due to EU humans rights laws.
 
I guess that is an upside sort of. Sure 40,000 very dodgey asylum seekers are loose in the UK not working nor paying taxes, but 40,000 fatties & 39 year old chicks are getting that shot at a baby they'd never normally have. So silver lining there.

Catogrande

On a personal, selfish level I see NO silver lining.

NTA

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rancid Schnitzel" data-cid="551256" data-time="1452144506">
Nick have you ever wondered why these people are galloping right through Eastern Europe and even Denmark and going straight for countries like Germany, Sweden and Norway that: (a)will let them stay (2) give them free shit? Actually I just answered that for you. As the Indonesia President once said, "Take the sugar off the table". 
With regard to work, the big question is what work these young men can actually do. They don't speak German and you have to study for years to be qualified for anything in Germany. They could do the shit jobs, but will they want to when the unemployment benefits are so generous? I've also read that even Syrians in Syria aren't keen to do the shit jobs. So I guess while you have a potential pool of labour, it appears to be largely composed of unskilled men who don't speak the language. Not exactly ideal.</blockquote>
 <blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rancid Schnitzel" data-cid="551258" data-time="1452144808">
Apologies Nick, I misread your post. Disregard.</blockquote>
 
:D 
I'm not really pro-refugee in order to fix a problem of the MidEast's making. I was just thinking out loud about what it means economically for Germany. 
The benefits - with one eyebrow raised at jegga's fixation with white burds being raped by camel-fuckers fresh out of the desert :fishing: - are there for all to see in terms of welfare etc. 
Mostly, I'm kind of shocked the krauts didn't have minimum wage as part of federal law.

NTA

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="gollum" data-cid="551316" data-time="1452159739">
<div>
But now with robotics & so on there aren't thousands of low paid unskilled labouring jobs, or if there are the Romanians & Bulgarians are already doing them. 
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Automation is going to make Western populations less employable as time goes by. Once robots do our cleaning for us, were do the unwashed masses turn?
 
Finland's experiment with basic wage for all will be interesting:
 
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-33977636'>http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-33977636</a>

Godder

Immigration is hard - most people clearly know very little about it. Studies show that immigration is a net positive economically, but it's a small impact unless numbers are cranked right up. Generally, the jobs taken by migrants are balanced by jobs created by their existence e.g. food, clothing, transport, housing, general consumption. It's a common misconception that allowing migrants to get visas as lowskilled workers undercuts locals, but most tertiary institutions are reliant on foreign students to stay afloat, and a number of regional towns and industries are dependent on migrant workers because NZers are less than keen to move there permanently, or take on that kind of work (e.g. farming, rest homes). Cutting back on that type of immigration will cause issues for those places and industries. However, too much of it depresses wages, and prevents unskilled locals from finding work, and can create an underclass of low skilled migrants. 
The flipside of that is the major issue with the concept of skilled migrants is that it cuts out opportunities for locals and interferes with their ability to study or retrain to fill those roles. Imagine doing career planning at high school 5 years ago and deciding to study accounting because there was a shortage at that time. You get a degree in accounting after 5 years of planning and study (2 at high school, 3 at university or polytech), and then discover you can't get a job in NZ because a stack of skilled migrants have filled most of the jobs, and the pay rates haven't moved in 5 years because the wave of migrants has repressed wage growth. That said, some skilled migrants are still needed as locals don't always stay in NZ... 
The point of the waffling above is that a mix of low and high skilled migrants is best as too much weight one way or the other creates its own issues.

gollum

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="NTA" data-cid="551336" data-time="1452172136">
<div>
Automation is going to make Western populations less employable as time goes by. Once robots do our cleaning for us, were do the unwashed masses turn?
 
Finland's experiment with basic wage for all will be interesting:
 
<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-33977636'>http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-33977636</a>
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Indeed. There will be an issue where a very small chunk of the population own the companies that make all the automated systems. So the jobs go, and the money is concentrated with only a few people.
 
EG Tesla teams up with Uber. 500,000 taxi drivers lose their jobs. And the profits go to 10,000 employees at Tesla/Uber.
 
Now repeat that for everything.
 
A company like Google has 50k employees in the US averaging 100k a year. So $5bn is being distributed. 50 years ago the top companies in the US were distributing $5bn (equivelant) in wages, but to 350,000 staff. Its why the middle class in the US has been evicerated.
 
Hence there is a school of thought that governments should own a chunk of all of the new disruptive tech's. IE if the US government own 10% of Google, when Google make $100bn from destroying a stack of jobs the government pockets $10bn as shareholders & uses it to pay a uiniversal wage to the 90% of the population that have no jobs & don't own shares in Google, Uber, Tesla, Lyft, Amazon, Microsoft, Intel etc.

Tim

<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://www.dw.com/en/reports-cologne-nye-assaulters-were-largely-asylum-seekers/a-18966406'>Reports: Cologne NYE assaulters were largely asylum-seekers</a>
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote">A majority of men who sexually harassed women in Cologne on New Year's Eve were asylum seekers, German media reports. City police reportedly did not want to publicize this because of its "politically awkward" nature.
 
</blockquote>

Virgil

I smell a big fat German cover up

jegga

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Tim" data-cid="551401" data-time="1452210326"><a class="bbc_url" href="http://www.dw.com/en/reports-cologne-nye-assaulters-were-largely-asylum-seekers/a-18966406">Reports: Cologne NYE assaulters were largely asylum-seekers</a></blockquote>
 
I just saw the Amy Winehouse doco , I was more surprised about her dying at the end than I am about reading that. 
On the plus side, we could be experiencing an influx of cashed up Europeans wanting to move here to get away from the idiocy of Merkel etc .

Tim

We already have thousands of French moving to NZ every year. :-/
 
;)

taniwharugby

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Virgil" data-cid="551412" data-time="1452216073">
<div>
I smell a big fat German cover up
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Kim.com?

Baron Silas Greenback

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="reprobate" data-cid="550922" data-time="1452039325">
<div>
so if a topic is locked, some people (mods?) can still post in it?
 
hypothetically speaking for example, in a global warming thread - someone could post an article from one point of view after it's locked so nobody would be able to rebut it?
 
now there's a conspiracy
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Stop your whining buttercups.

NTA

That article is pretty short on facts, beyond this:
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote">According to the newspapers' reports, citing officers on duty on New Year's Eve, officials checked the IDs of at least 100 people present at Cologne's central station on December 31 after their behavior became conspicuous. Seventy-one people were identified, 11 people were remanded into custody and 32 criminal complaints were registered, according to the Welt am Sonntag (WamS) report.
"There were, quite to the contrary of what was said publicly, identity checks on numerous people," the WamS quoted an unnamed officer as saying. "Most of them were recently-arrived asylum-seekers."
The first internal police report on the event - a so-called "wichtige Ereignis Meldung" ("important event announcement") - spoke of a crowd mainly of "North African and Arab" origin. According to the KÃ¶lner Stadt-anzeiger, the officer leading the team at the station wanted the report to include mention of the Syrians and asylum seekers, but the senior officer writing the "WE-Meldung" decided not to, saying it would be "politically awkward."
It is still unclear whether the same persons were involved in the assaults.</blockquote>
 
 
Other than that, two unnamed officers reporting the same guys were in on the sexual assault stuff.
 
The chief of police should lose his job for putting out bullshit statements about peaceful conduct, but unless you've got this "thousand" men of "North African and Arab origin" all lined up and can prove they're asylum seekers, you're distilling the bits you want out of Chinese whispers.
 
At night on NYE I'll bet most men tend to look foreign - and what if they're second- or third-gen immigrants who happen to be a bit swarthy?
 
And, regardless of who the fuck they are and where they come from, its disgusting and they should get deported if they're asylum seekers, or serious jail time and fines if they're citizens.

jegga

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="NTA" data-cid="551454" data-time="1452236954">
That article is pretty short on facts, beyond this: 
Other than that, two unnamed officers reporting the same guys were in on the sexual assault stuff. 
The chief of police should lose his job for putting out bullshit statements about peaceful conduct, but unless you've got this "thousand" men of "North African and Arab origin" all lined up and can prove they're asylum seekers, you're distilling the bits you want out of Chinese whispers. 
At night on NYE I'll bet most men tend to look foreign - and what if they're second- or third-gen immigrants who happen to be a bit swarthy? 
And, regardless of who the fuck they are and where they come from, its disgusting and they should get deported if they're asylum seekers, or serious jail time and fines if they're citizens.</blockquote>
 
I ain't obsessed with camel rooters being rapey, I was saying this was going to happen months ago because of the way they see us and their belief that our laws are irrelevant as Sharia law is the one they follow. Sure enough they've behaved even more appallingly than I said they would in the thread that got locked . 
How did they think they were going to be able to stop word of what happened getting out in the internet age ? 
It looks like the poms are going to exit the eu if the latest polls are anything to go by, any of our British posters think that helping keep out these ferals is a factor?

Catogrande

Jegga - I'll go out on a limb here - I don't see anyway that we will exit the EU. There are simply too many problems to overcome and too many side stories to consider. The big one being what if there is a geographical split on the referendum and Scotland wants to stay in the EU? What price another referendum on Scottish independence? I could quite see our terms of membership being watered down with border controls and movement of people in general being high on the list, but beyond that I don't see much happening. There are also a load of vested interests - God knows how many Euro MPs we now have slurping along on the gravy train, plus so many others as special envoy to the EU covering egg production or cucumber sizing or whatever bollocks they can think up. These pretty much failed politicos (Neil Kinnock anyone) are paid at a level that their UK counterparts can only dream about.
 
It's a truism that eggs are a lot easier to scramble than to un-scramble.

jegga

Cheers Cato that was an interesting take , I was reading this <a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='https://www.3news.co.nz/world/majority-of-brits-would-leave-eu---poll-2016010715'>https://www.3news.co.nz/world/majority-of-brits-would-leave-eu---poll-2016010715</a>

Catogrande

I'm always a bit sceptical about such polls to be honest. As in most elections there are the die hard fors and againsts and it is the middle ground that decide things. Experience shows me that on one off referendums there is a very high chance of there being no change because people don't like and fear change. Then there is the transient nature of many of the people who say they are for change, taking an overly emotive stance which many back down from, either because their particular fear has been assuaged or they are all wind and piss in the first place and are just blowing off steam.
 
One of the things I have to do in my work is to try and ascertain clients' appetite for investment risk on an ongoing basis. The first step in this is to get them to complete a short questionnaire to arrive at a score which is then the basis for further discussion. It may come as no surprise but almost any client will exhibit a seemingly greater appetite for risk if their recent experience has been good and vice-versa if their investments have disappointed. I feel that there is a significant element of this in the current polling - strip out the immigrant issue and I reckon the results would be quite different. So Cameron's task is to make the immigrant issue as irrelevant as possible for the UK and then it should be mission accomplished. If not I feel the vote will be close but still for remaining in the EU. Also, don't forget, the wording on the referendum voting slips has yet to be revealed, don't under-estimate the slipperiness of the politicians to frame it to suit their agendas. A simple in or out? I doubt it.

jegga

<a data-ipb='nomediaparse' href='http://m.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11571501'>http://m.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11571501</a> 
I'm quite surprised he got to do 19 universities before it made the news.

Rancid Schnitzel

I think Britain will stay in the EU. From the outside looking in it seems to be like a man contemplating leaving his wife. Yes she's become fat and bloated, nags too much and costs you shit loads of money. Yes she has stupid rules and doesn't give a damn what you think. But you've been together for so long that the thought of being without her is farking scary. A divorce will also be ridiculously complicated and involve all manner of legal bullshit. Add the fact that she still gives the very occasional blow job. What happens if I leave and never get another bj? Taking all that into account, maybe it's best to go with the safe option.

The Silver Fern

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