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@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@voodoo said in US Politics:
I'd add that selecting Hillary wasn't actually a bad decision. She totally should have won that election, it was absolutely hers to lose.
She was probbly the best minnow in a very shallow pool, but she came across as entitled, clumsy and pretty much out of touch with Joe Public. From what I read, people were tiring from Obama's gesture politics and wanted someone, anyone who'd actually do stuff.
Yeah, the Democrats look a real mess. In fact US Politics - and the media - looks a real mess. Perhaps the Virus Crisis will cause the political establishment to take a good, long look at itself.
Yep, that's kinda my point. She was a disaster, but still won more votes and came close to winning. Just a few idiot moves away from taking the prize.
Pelosi takes the cake for being out of touch though with her ice cream clip. Holy smokes.
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@antipodean said in US Politics:
That and unlike a sizeable proportion of the political elite in the USA, he understands and panders to his electorate.
The sort of thing only an idiot wouldn't do.....
The guy drives me nuts and I cringe when he speaks. But when you compare him to Obama on dealing with Syria and Nth Korea and you can see why people voted for him.
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@antipodean said in US Politics:
If the Democrats had any sense, Biden would've been arseholed out of the contest a long time ago.
"But it's his turn!"
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@voodoo said in US Politics:
@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@voodoo said in US Politics:
I'd add that selecting Hillary wasn't actually a bad decision. She totally should have won that election, it was absolutely hers to lose.
She was probbly the best minnow in a very shallow pool, but she came across as entitled, clumsy and pretty much out of touch with Joe Public. From what I read, people were tiring from Obama's gesture politics and wanted someone, anyone who'd actually do stuff.
Yeah, the Democrats look a real mess. In fact US Politics - and the media - looks a real mess. Perhaps the Virus Crisis will cause the political establishment to take a good, long look at itself.
Yep, that's kinda my point. She was a disaster, but still won more votes and came close to winning. Just a few idiot moves away from taking the prize.
Pelosi takes the cake for being out of touch though with her ice cream clip. Holy smokes.
Dunno mate. As I remember it, it was hers to lose. Trump was a joke candidate and noisy America was celebrating a first woman president right up to election night. The whole world was flabbergasted that this reality show blowhard actually won. Hillary screwed up which proved to be a decisive portent to the democrats political acumen the next 4 years.
He can be an idiot but he won the vote, and that's all the game is.
Not being able to poll better than the idiot is the real story of Trumps presidency
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haha, Trump's team (and all the meme warriors) supply endless laughs, this one, this time at Plug's expense
https://www.donaldjtrump.com/error -
@Wairau said in US Politics:
haha, Trump's team (and all the meme warriors) supply endless laughs, this one, this time at Plug's expense
https://www.donaldjtrump.com/errorReminds me of the golden days of "Google Bombing"
You did a Google search for "idiot" and the top result was "Gordon Brown, UK Prime MInister"
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@Siam said in US Politics:
Not being able to poll better than the idiot is the real story of Trumps presidency
I think the real story of trump's presidency is the massive global damage to usa's reputation, the internal damage and increased polarisation of their political system, and the treatment of facts/expert knowledge as just opinions on an equal footing with any random fool's opinion.
China really could not have hoped for a better outcome in terms of their aim for increased global influence, the US is a laughing stock. -
@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Siam said in US Politics:
Not being able to poll better than the idiot is the real story of Trumps presidency
I think the real story of trump's presidency is the massive global damage to usa's reputation, the internal damage and increased polarisation of their political system, and the treatment of facts/expert knowledge as just opinions on an equal footing with any random fool's opinion.
China really could not have hoped for a better outcome in terms of their aim for increased global influence, the US is a laughing stock.TBF, that was going on long before Trump. And Obama is equally to blame - his weakness and withdrawal from the world gave Putin & China a nice warm power vacuum to fill.
Agree with you on Trump's "fool's opinions" but just think Obama's platitudes, virtue-signalling and excuses for inaction were equally as bad,
How the US got itself into a situation where likes of Trump, Pelosi, Biden etc are the heavyweight politicians is beyond me..
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Obama has been piping a bit recently when he is customarily very quiet.
He had a comment "accidentally leaked" on the Flynn matter and yesterday he ripped into Trump over Covid-19.
I think his motivation is he is worried about Biden, who is coming across as so ineffectual and confused. Obama wants to try and defend himself and by extension Biden because Trump is pursuing the strategy of tying Biden to Obama and then attacking Obama over the spying allegations. Biden doesn't seem to know what to say.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in US Politics:
@reprobate said in US Politics:
@Siam said in US Politics:
Not being able to poll better than the idiot is the real story of Trumps presidency
I think the real story of trump's presidency is the massive global damage to usa's reputation, the internal damage and increased polarisation of their political system, and the treatment of facts/expert knowledge as just opinions on an equal footing with any random fool's opinion.
China really could not have hoped for a better outcome in terms of their aim for increased global influence, the US is a laughing stock.TBF, that was going on long before Trump. And Obama is equally to blame - his weakness and withdrawal from the world gave Putin & China a nice warm power vacuum to fill.
Agree with you on Trump's "fool's opinions" but just think Obama's platitudes, virtue-signalling and excuses for inaction were equally as bad,
How the US got itself into a situation where likes of Trump, Pelosi, Biden etc are the heavyweight politicians is beyond me..
After the clusterfuck that was the Bush years, one can hardly blame Obama (and indeed Trump) for a reluctance to get aggressively involved in international affairs, particularly any armed conflict.
The mistake was probably to encourage resolution around the globe (mainly the ME), but then not provide military support. That being said, when they did get involved, they caught absolute hell for it.
In short, the US President simply can't win.
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@junior said in US Politics:
After the clusterfuck that was the Bush years, one can hardly blame Obama (and indeed Trump) for a reluctance to get aggressively involved in international affairs, particularly any armed conflict.
Less a reluctance, more a continual re-definition of red-lines & political objectives to avoid taking action. Made the US look weak. One of the few things Trump did right was sending a strong military message to Assad & Putin early on.
In short, the US President simply can't win.
Not if they come from the recent presidential gene pool, they can't...
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Just finished Malcolm Turnbull’s memoirs this weekend. Much like Obama you get the feeling they both (rightfully) have big tickets on themselves and are having massive issues reconciling that their life’s crowning achievement was achieved by someone they consider so inferior - Abbott and Trump respectively.
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@canefan said in Coronavirus - Overall:
being the only developed country without a national health system beggars belief also
Other countries have insurance based systems. Obamacare was a poorly implemented copy of the Swiss system for instance
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@Duluth said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@canefan said in Coronavirus - Overall:
being the only developed country without a national health system beggars belief also
Other countries have insurance based systems. Obamacare was a poorly implemented copy of the Swiss system for instance
Poorly implemented or not, it seemed that most people in the US are philosophically opposed to government subsidised healthcare.
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@canefan said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@dogmeat being the only developed country without a national health system beggars belief also
Especially when you consider they spend nearly twice the public funds per capita than any other nation.
A good article on it is in the NYTIMes (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/05/upshot/the-real-reason-the-us-has-employer-sponsored-health-insurance.html) but what it doesn't spell out is how complicit organised labour was in driving this series of events by joining the medical profession and insurance industry in preventing state based systems. Instead they opted to make it based on collective bargaining agreements.
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@canefan said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@Duluth said in Coronavirus - Overall:
@canefan said in Coronavirus - Overall:
being the only developed country without a national health system beggars belief also
Other countries have insurance based systems. Obamacare was a poorly implemented copy of the Swiss system for instance
Poorly implemented or not, it seemed that most people in the US are philosophically opposed to government subsidised healthcare.
Some Republicans are philosophically opposed to it - Obamacare was quite similar to Mitt Romney's system in Massachusetts, so it's not even all Republicans.
I believe polls show strong support for some sort of public health care, but it's harder to get majority support for specific proposals, and even harder if you don't have both parties on board to some extent because the opposition will be higher if it's not bipartisan.
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@Godder said in US Politics:
I believe polls show strong support for some sort of public health care, but it's harder to get majority support for specific proposals, and even harder if you don't have both parties on board to some extent because the opposition will be higher if it's not bipartisan.
It wasn't smart politics from the Dems back in at the beginning of the Obama term. I think Obama thought if he based a plan around a Republican-ish plan everyone would fall into line.
The reality is bigger trade offs were need (interstate competition etc). The Dems went to a position of "we don't need your votes" too quicklyThat meant a handful of Dem holdouts became very important. The way the last handful of votes were purchased resulted in some terrible additions to the law. That's one of the reasons Obamacare does not look much like Romneycare (or the Swiss system)
Without partisan cover there was no ability to set the penalties at the correct level (making a death spiral inevitable).
There was also no courage to stand by the costs. Various taxes were delayed and then dropped. A classic politicians position - for the benefit but not the cost.But one of the biggest obstacles is that a Swiss plan probably requires a constitutional amendment. Try that without making concessions to the other party.
US Politics