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@gt12 well I bought a new car in 2015, and the EV version was an extra $20k, and I worked out at the start of 2020, I was still ahead of the cost of buying the EV version, without even costing the electricity needed.
Havent looked deeply into what the subsidy might so, but I decided post covid I am not in the market for a new car anyway.
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@taniwharugby said in NZ Politics:
well I bought a new car in 2015, and the EV version was an extra $20k, and I worked out at the start of 2020, I was still ahead of the cost of buying the EV version, without even costing the electricity needed.
That very much depends on the car of course and how much you think the resale is eventually.
It also isn't 2015.
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We simply have sweet fa options for EVs available in NZ. Like seriously!
The market needs to have a range of makes, models and price points and that's before you even start with addressing the fact that only a small portion of cars brought are new ones simply because $.I do agree that you have to start pushing and incentivizing and the earlier the better but if my 3.2l petrol guzzler is to be scrapped I need to be able to replace it with a vehicle suitable for purpose that doesn't cost 8 times as much.
My other gripe is that I don't buy new cars. Cars to me are a means to an end and serve a purpose. They get to transport dogs, junk, mud and get driven where they can go. Basically I don't take care of them much.
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@nzzp said in NZ Politics:
@gt12 said in NZ Politics:
@tim said in NZ Politics:
How efficient is the move to electric cars in NZ? My parents don’t want to go near them because their electricity bill is already hundreds of dollars, but I cant bothered running the numbers. Anyway know of a source that breaks it down for those doing most of their charging off the grid?
no specific source, but it's about a fifth or less of the cost of running it off petrol. Less again if you have solar. And maintenance is massively cheaper - have some friends with Nissan Leafs, and in a few years they have changed windscreen wiper fluid and tyres ... and that's about it
Are we comparing apples with apples here? If the context is cars within scope for the feebate scheme then it applies to cars new to the market doesn't it? If we assume that those in the market for a used import are generally spending less than the cost of an EV, then the other cars new to the market are in fact new cars. Maintenance is negligible on most new cars, with warranties and inclusive service plans of 3 years or more being pretty standard now.
In fact one of the most inequitable parts of the car market is that those not in a position to buy a new car are the people most likely to have the highest running costs. They also run cars that are less reliable, less safe and more polluting, but that's another story.
Maybe the government could help encourage those people into more modern vehicles...
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@crucial most new cars are fleet cars of one sort or another, but as they roll through the system over a few years, the ratio of EV to ICE will improve rapidly.
Would like to see some plans for low income earners though, especially those who can only afford the <$5k or even <$2k cars.
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@godder said in NZ Politics:
@crucial most new cars are fleet cars of one sort or another, but as they roll through the system over a few years, the ratio of EV to ICE will improve rapidly.
Would like to see some plans for low income earners though, especially those who can only afford the <$5k or even <$2k cars.
But look at what those cars are. Currently the range is very high end apart from one or two. None of them are going to tow my offroad camper over Danseys Pass.
So in 10 years time we will still be in the position of needing to buy new for much other than town runabouts and overpriced used touring cars that will need a stop and plug every couple of hundy kms as the batteries don't hold as much.
We are at the shitty end of the distribution from manufacturers as they have to fill the orders from other bigger countries first. I just wonder if this has been thought through properly as to how long it will take.
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@jc said in NZ Politics:
@nzzp said in NZ Politics:
@gt12 said in NZ Politics:
@tim said in NZ Politics:
How efficient is the move to electric cars in NZ? My parents don’t want to go near them because their electricity bill is already hundreds of dollars, but I cant bothered running the numbers. Anyway know of a source that breaks it down for those doing most of their charging off the grid?
no specific source, but it's about a fifth or less of the cost of running it off petrol. Less again if you have solar. And maintenance is massively cheaper - have some friends with Nissan Leafs, and in a few years they have changed windscreen wiper fluid and tyres ... and that's about it
Are we comparing apples with apples here? If the context is cars within scope for the feebate scheme then it applies to cars new to the market doesn't it?
Used Nissan Leafs imported are under 20k, so the 3k subsidy is nice. It's a thumb on the scale, tipping people at the margin over into buying an ev. Where it's the best way to drive that is another question, but for a day to day round town car out really works.
Also, the model 3 Tesla has dropped from nearly 80k to low 60s in a few months due to this and Tesla. That's tempting for urban folk, myself included
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@dogmeat said in NZ Politics:
Cindy's a big fan of the harbour cycle crossing. I have had a fair bit of exposure to this Project in its various iterations as my brothers house is one of the properties that is being compulsorily purchased and as he lives overseas I have attended countless meetings.
My take out from it all. The cycling lobby are one of the most selfish self-entitled bunch of piston wristed gibbons you would ever have to meet. They come up with all the justifications in the world but the reality is they don't give a shit about pedestrians or even leisure cyclist. They have decried any compromise that would mean they would have to slow down or horrors dismount for 30 seconds. They hide behind a revolving circus of justifications; climate change, tourism, saving the dolphins, relieving traffic congestion but the reality is they just want to be able to speed across the bridge and feel smug.
Mind you compared to Waka Kotahi they are paragons of virtue. WK are untrustworthy duplicitous shitheads.
I, of course, am a saint.
I'm also with @nzzp despite all the above I would like a cycling and walking route into the
barsCBD, but not at that price. When so much of Akl's cycling infrastructure is just a white line that motorists can ignore we would get a far better return spending the money elsewhereDoesn't surprise me this.
Despite being a petrol head of the highest order, I fully support, and take part in, any initiative to get people to cycle to work. It's cleaner, healthier & cheaper as transportation mechanism than anything which has an engine. Cities with cycle routes, work. There has been huge criticism of London's bike lanes, but as a regular user (in normal times anyway), they work well. Ive been doing some rides to Surrey for exercise / training, and I get from City to Putney in around 35 mins. You can't do that on any public or private transport. If I still lived around Fulham, I'd not consider any other commute.
However, what you say about the cyclists is 100% spot on. Absolute bunch of self centred piston wristed gibbons.
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@raznomore said in NZ Politics:
What's everyone's take on Cindy's Dawn Raid apology?
Don't let the fact I am a second gen NZ Samoan stop your honesty.
I think they are brilliant at finding issues which score them points and cost them nothing.
I don't think she or any of her PR staff gives a shit about the issue itself, but it may also make some people feel better.
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@raznomore said in NZ Politics:
What's everyone's take on Cindy's Dawn Raid apology?
Don't let the fact I am a second gen NZ Samoan stop your honesty.
I hadn't even heard of them until recently I am sorry to say. Certainly a dark period in the nation's history, and not the first time that a minority ethnic group have been discriminated against
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@gt12 said in NZ Politics:
@raznomore said in NZ Politics:
What's everyone's take on Cindy's Dawn Raid apology?
Don't let the fact I am a second gen NZ Samoan stop your honesty.
I think they are brilliant at finding issues which score them points and cost them nothing.
I don't think she or any of her PR staff gives a shit about the issue itself, but it may also make some people feel better.
First sentence - agree
Second - disagree - I have no doubt they are genuinely held beliefs, and honest regret for what occurred.
@raznomore what's your take? You were very quiet on it in your post...
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Irrespective of motive. The chance to make an apology so past deeds don't linger as a bad smell is good IMO.
This is one of the good points about our political system. We can swing each way to get things done that the other party wouldn't touch then vice-versa. We aren't as entrenched as say the US.
I am currently working in an area that has needed change for years and that change is only being supported due to a double term Labour and their ideals being a better match.I am sure that there are other changes needed out there that are biding time for a second term National govt to take its turn.
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I was in Te Papa a few months ago. Part of an exhibit at the time was some wooden flooring from Western Springs college with some graffiti on it. From Dawn Raids era when inspectors would visit school, the school PA system would send out warning and PI students with dodgy immigration status were hidden under this flooring. As they were waiting it out some wrote on the wood.
Very moving actually, made my eyes a bit blurry.
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@nzzp my own family was subjected to it although my dad was born here. I wasn't born yet but across the wider family it's a very sore point and there is long standing mistrust of government and police.
I don't doubt many people will appreciate the sentiment but its not really doing anything. It's just point scoring imo. It's not something where restitution would or should be paid out. So as mentioned it's a bit of posturing that costs the government nothing.
What probably gets me going though is there crowd out there saying it was justified. The overstayers at the time were mostly Amercian, English and Australians. But because of public perception and high incidence of crime within the PI community they were unfairly targeted. It's that type of opinion that "they deserved it" still held today that infuriates me. Yes they were over stayers and yes they needed to be weeded out but its the double standard these people were subjected to. Maori being stopped in the street etc.
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@raznomore said in NZ Politics:
What's everyone's take on Cindy's Dawn Raid apology?
Don't let the fact I am a second gen NZ Samoan stop your honesty.
Government optics purely inline with Jacinda's approach of running the country. Always make the decisions for your own PR purposes.
I can't comment on if it will achieve anything for the greater Pasifika people, but my (limited) understanding of what happened here does tell me that it's perhaps something that was long overdue. Dawn raids against a specific race of people is truly shocking. As you mention, the longstanding effects of these (mistrust of government / police) affect everybody.
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