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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@taniwharugby said in US Politics:
@canefan not misrepresent, alternate.
There are so many alternate facts flying around from all sides..... the media is a mess.
It's one thing to slant the facts; something the left leaning MSM do more and more. It is another thing entirely to make shit up
The left wing media like CNN also blatantly make stuff up. There are numerous examples.
Conway cited a massacre that never happened as justification for the order. If you can provide one similarly glaring case of outright lying I'm happy to see it
On scale or outright lying?
How about just this last day when CNN tweeted out that Milo was a white supremacist? Blatant lie.or from Obama...
"The steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to.""
""We have doubled the distance our cars will go on a gallon of gas.""
there are many others.
Milo is a racist sounds like opinion to me but voiced by the MSM is irresponsible because it could be taken as fact. I don't have figures about US steel but if we are talking about cars of the past vs now I'd agree they are far more efficient wouldn't you? If CNN had stated that Trump was actually born in Germany and was therefore not eligible to run for president that would be a lie
Both of the statements Obama made were FALSE! There were lies. Lies are lies. And those were just 2 examples to prove the point.
The fact you had likely not heard about them is indicative of the way they were largely ignored. Can you honestly analyse the reaction if Trump said that sort of thing today? Or Conway? Alternative facts? Fake News? Widespread coverage?
Surely you can see thew double standard?So to look at one statement taken on face value, you don't think it is possible that advances in auto technology and fuel efficiency couldn't make the statement about cars and fuel consumption valid?
No it is simply untrue. He wasnt saying things had improved, which they obviously have, he was making an imperical statement of fact.. which was untrue.
I was just curious enough to Google it. I found this table that seems to bear his statement out doesn't it?
This was the source material
I don't know who these guys are. If it is a shell organisation owned by Barack Obama then my bad
I am assuming of course that when Obama says 'We' he means 'people that make cars', as opposed to 'my 8 year administration, because that would be silly. You've only posted one line so the context could be entirely different to my assumption
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@Frank said in US Politics:
@taniwharugby
Because the vast majority of CNN's/MSNBC's audience is liberal. The US is so tribal now.I was referring to your comment about MSM below, didn't realise it was specific networks you were referring to
A good way to solve this problem is for MSM to get some pro-Trump people in their reporting ranks. Hire journalists who actually understand and identify with his supporters. That Trump supporters can relate to. But I don't think they will do that because their ratings might go down.
Everything is divided into tribes now. -
The immigration thing is starting to get predictably murky
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@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@taniwharugby said in US Politics:
@canefan not misrepresent, alternate.
There are so many alternate facts flying around from all sides..... the media is a mess.
It's one thing to slant the facts; something the left leaning MSM do more and more. It is another thing entirely to make shit up
The left wing media like CNN also blatantly make stuff up. There are numerous examples.
Conway cited a massacre that never happened as justification for the order. If you can provide one similarly glaring case of outright lying I'm happy to see it
On scale or outright lying?
How about just this last day when CNN tweeted out that Milo was a white supremacist? Blatant lie.or from Obama...
"The steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to.""
""We have doubled the distance our cars will go on a gallon of gas.""
there are many others.
Milo is a racist sounds like opinion to me but voiced by the MSM is irresponsible because it could be taken as fact. I don't have figures about US steel but if we are talking about cars of the past vs now I'd agree they are far more efficient wouldn't you? If CNN had stated that Trump was actually born in Germany and was therefore not eligible to run for president that would be a lie
Both of the statements Obama made were FALSE! There were lies. Lies are lies. And those were just 2 examples to prove the point.
The fact you had likely not heard about them is indicative of the way they were largely ignored. Can you honestly analyse the reaction if Trump said that sort of thing today? Or Conway? Alternative facts? Fake News? Widespread coverage?
Surely you can see thew double standard?So to look at one statement taken on face value, you don't think it is possible that advances in auto technology and fuel efficiency couldn't make the statement about cars and fuel consumption valid?
No it is simply untrue. He wasnt saying things had improved, which they obviously have, he was making an imperical statement of fact.. which was untrue.
I was just curious enough to Google it. I found this table that seems to bear his statement out doesn't it?
This was the source material
I don't know who these guys are. If it is a shell organisation owned by Barack Obama then my bad
I am assuming of course that when Obama says 'We' he means 'people that make cars', as opposed to 'my 8 year administration, because that would be silly. You've only posted one line so the context could be entirely different to my assumption
That was my understanding too. The statement when taken in that context is self evidently true - you just need to determine the base point to measure from.
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
"The steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to.""
Once again I employed a little long weekend investigation and found this
It would graphically suggest Mr President was spouting an 'alternate fact' in this case. With all these alternate facts around I think the mods will need to add a Pinochio emoji
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@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@taniwharugby said in US Politics:
@canefan not misrepresent, alternate.
There are so many alternate facts flying around from all sides..... the media is a mess.
It's one thing to slant the facts; something the left leaning MSM do more and more. It is another thing entirely to make shit up
The left wing media like CNN also blatantly make stuff up. There are numerous examples.
Conway cited a massacre that never happened as justification for the order. If you can provide one similarly glaring case of outright lying I'm happy to see it
On scale or outright lying?
How about just this last day when CNN tweeted out that Milo was a white supremacist? Blatant lie.or from Obama...
"The steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to.""
""We have doubled the distance our cars will go on a gallon of gas.""
there are many others.
Milo is a racist sounds like opinion to me but voiced by the MSM is irresponsible because it could be taken as fact. I don't have figures about US steel but if we are talking about cars of the past vs now I'd agree they are far more efficient wouldn't you? If CNN had stated that Trump was actually born in Germany and was therefore not eligible to run for president that would be a lie
Both of the statements Obama made were FALSE! There were lies. Lies are lies. And those were just 2 examples to prove the point.
The fact you had likely not heard about them is indicative of the way they were largely ignored. Can you honestly analyse the reaction if Trump said that sort of thing today? Or Conway? Alternative facts? Fake News? Widespread coverage?
Surely you can see thew double standard?So to look at one statement taken on face value, you don't think it is possible that advances in auto technology and fuel efficiency couldn't make the statement about cars and fuel consumption valid?
No it is simply untrue. He wasnt saying things had improved, which they obviously have, he was making an imperical statement of fact.. which was untrue.
I was just curious enough to Google it. I found this table that seems to bear his statement out doesn't it?
This was the source material
I don't know who these guys are. If it is a shell organisation owned by Barack Obama then my bad
I am assuming of course that when Obama says 'We' he means 'people that make cars', as opposed to 'my 8 year administration, because that would be silly. You've only posted one line so the context could be entirely different to my assumption
What? you are comparing it to what year 1975?
He was talking about his administration.
I should have mad that clear. -
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@canefan said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@taniwharugby said in US Politics:
@canefan not misrepresent, alternate.
There are so many alternate facts flying around from all sides..... the media is a mess.
It's one thing to slant the facts; something the left leaning MSM do more and more. It is another thing entirely to make shit up
The left wing media like CNN also blatantly make stuff up. There are numerous examples.
Conway cited a massacre that never happened as justification for the order. If you can provide one similarly glaring case of outright lying I'm happy to see it
On scale or outright lying?
How about just this last day when CNN tweeted out that Milo was a white supremacist? Blatant lie.or from Obama...
"The steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to.""
""We have doubled the distance our cars will go on a gallon of gas.""
there are many others.
Milo is a racist sounds like opinion to me but voiced by the MSM is irresponsible because it could be taken as fact. I don't have figures about US steel but if we are talking about cars of the past vs now I'd agree they are far more efficient wouldn't you? If CNN had stated that Trump was actually born in Germany and was therefore not eligible to run for president that would be a lie
Both of the statements Obama made were FALSE! There were lies. Lies are lies. And those were just 2 examples to prove the point.
The fact you had likely not heard about them is indicative of the way they were largely ignored. Can you honestly analyse the reaction if Trump said that sort of thing today? Or Conway? Alternative facts? Fake News? Widespread coverage?
Surely you can see thew double standard?So to look at one statement taken on face value, you don't think it is possible that advances in auto technology and fuel efficiency couldn't make the statement about cars and fuel consumption valid?
No it is simply untrue. He wasnt saying things had improved, which they obviously have, he was making an imperical statement of fact.. which was untrue.
I was just curious enough to Google it. I found this table that seems to bear his statement out doesn't it?
This was the source material
I don't know who these guys are. If it is a shell organisation owned by Barack Obama then my bad
I am assuming of course that when Obama says 'We' he means 'people that make cars', as opposed to 'my 8 year administration, because that would be silly. You've only posted one line so the context could be entirely different to my assumption
What? you are comparing it to what year 1975?
He was talking about his administration.Okay. Back to Google.....
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I dont rate politifact nowdays though...
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
What? you are comparing it to what year 1975?
He was talking about his administration.
I should have mad that clear.How do you infer that?
A day after Trump’s speech, Barack Obama brought up the history of American steel during a joint appearance with the Canadian prime minister and the Mexican president, who were meeting for a summit in Ottawa.
Reporters asked the three leaders what they would do to counter the anti-free-trade sentiment exemplified by Trump. Obama acknowledged the shortcomings of trade agreements, but he argued that reverting to tariffs and a possible trade war was the wrong way to improve the situation. He pointed to technological change as an irreversible factor.
"This nostalgia about an era when everybody was working in manufacturing jobs, and you didn’t need a college degree, and you could go in and as long as you worked hard you could support a family and live a middle-class life -- that has been undermined far more by automation than it has been by outsourcing or the shift of jobs to ... low-wage countries," Obama said. "I mean, the steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to."
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@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
What? you are comparing it to what year 1975?
He was talking about his administration.
I should have mad that clear.How do you infer that?
A day after Trump’s speech, Barack Obama brought up the history of American steel during a joint appearance with the Canadian prime minister and the Mexican president, who were meeting for a summit in Ottawa.
Reporters asked the three leaders what they would do to counter the anti-free-trade sentiment exemplified by Trump. Obama acknowledged the shortcomings of trade agreements, but he argued that reverting to tariffs and a possible trade war was the wrong way to improve the situation. He pointed to technological change as an irreversible factor.
"This nostalgia about an era when everybody was working in manufacturing jobs, and you didn’t need a college degree, and you could go in and as long as you worked hard you could support a family and live a middle-class life -- that has been undermined far more by automation than it has been by outsourcing or the shift of jobs to ... low-wage countries," Obama said. "I mean, the steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to."
I was talking about the fuel consumption lie
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
What? you are comparing it to what year 1975?
He was talking about his administration.
I should have mad that clear.How do you infer that?
A day after Trump’s speech, Barack Obama brought up the history of American steel during a joint appearance with the Canadian prime minister and the Mexican president, who were meeting for a summit in Ottawa.
Reporters asked the three leaders what they would do to counter the anti-free-trade sentiment exemplified by Trump. Obama acknowledged the shortcomings of trade agreements, but he argued that reverting to tariffs and a possible trade war was the wrong way to improve the situation. He pointed to technological change as an irreversible factor.
"This nostalgia about an era when everybody was working in manufacturing jobs, and you didn’t need a college degree, and you could go in and as long as you worked hard you could support a family and live a middle-class life -- that has been undermined far more by automation than it has been by outsourcing or the shift of jobs to ... low-wage countries," Obama said. "I mean, the steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to."
I was talking about the fuel consumption lie
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@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
What? you are comparing it to what year 1975?
He was talking about his administration.
I should have mad that clear.How do you infer that?
A day after Trump’s speech, Barack Obama brought up the history of American steel during a joint appearance with the Canadian prime minister and the Mexican president, who were meeting for a summit in Ottawa.
Reporters asked the three leaders what they would do to counter the anti-free-trade sentiment exemplified by Trump. Obama acknowledged the shortcomings of trade agreements, but he argued that reverting to tariffs and a possible trade war was the wrong way to improve the situation. He pointed to technological change as an irreversible factor.
"This nostalgia about an era when everybody was working in manufacturing jobs, and you didn’t need a college degree, and you could go in and as long as you worked hard you could support a family and live a middle-class life -- that has been undermined far more by automation than it has been by outsourcing or the shift of jobs to ... low-wage countries," Obama said. "I mean, the steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to."
I was talking about the fuel consumption lie
Yes and? I am just not sure what point you are trying to make. Did you follow the link I provided?
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
What? you are comparing it to what year 1975?
He was talking about his administration.
I should have mad that clear.How do you infer that?
A day after Trump’s speech, Barack Obama brought up the history of American steel during a joint appearance with the Canadian prime minister and the Mexican president, who were meeting for a summit in Ottawa.
Reporters asked the three leaders what they would do to counter the anti-free-trade sentiment exemplified by Trump. Obama acknowledged the shortcomings of trade agreements, but he argued that reverting to tariffs and a possible trade war was the wrong way to improve the situation. He pointed to technological change as an irreversible factor.
"This nostalgia about an era when everybody was working in manufacturing jobs, and you didn’t need a college degree, and you could go in and as long as you worked hard you could support a family and live a middle-class life -- that has been undermined far more by automation than it has been by outsourcing or the shift of jobs to ... low-wage countries," Obama said. "I mean, the steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to."
I was talking about the fuel consumption lie
Yes and? I am just not sure what point you are trying to make.
Are you being deliberately obtuse? There are two ways to take the statement "we have doubled the distance our cars will go". The tweet shows which one he meant.
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@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
What? you are comparing it to what year 1975?
He was talking about his administration.
I should have mad that clear.How do you infer that?
A day after Trump’s speech, Barack Obama brought up the history of American steel during a joint appearance with the Canadian prime minister and the Mexican president, who were meeting for a summit in Ottawa.
Reporters asked the three leaders what they would do to counter the anti-free-trade sentiment exemplified by Trump. Obama acknowledged the shortcomings of trade agreements, but he argued that reverting to tariffs and a possible trade war was the wrong way to improve the situation. He pointed to technological change as an irreversible factor.
"This nostalgia about an era when everybody was working in manufacturing jobs, and you didn’t need a college degree, and you could go in and as long as you worked hard you could support a family and live a middle-class life -- that has been undermined far more by automation than it has been by outsourcing or the shift of jobs to ... low-wage countries," Obama said. "I mean, the steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to."
I was talking about the fuel consumption lie
Yes and? I am just not sure what point you are trying to make.
Are you being deliberately obtuse? There are two ways to take the statement "we have doubled the distance our cars will go". The tweet shows which one he meant.
No.
In his state of the nation address in late January he lied and said this"We produce more oil at home than we have in 15 years. We have doubled the distance our cars will go on a gallon of gas and the amount of renewable energy we generate from sources like wind and solar, with tens of thousands of good, American jobs to show for it.""
Then when he was caught out/corrected ... he tweeted out the real story... over 2 weeks later.
That is like Conway making a stupid claim.. and then tweeting out the real story.
Just read the link to politico, because frankly I am sick of trying to explain to you what is already explained in the ink I provided.
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@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
What? you are comparing it to what year 1975?
He was talking about his administration.
I should have mad that clear.How do you infer that?
A day after Trump’s speech, Barack Obama brought up the history of American steel during a joint appearance with the Canadian prime minister and the Mexican president, who were meeting for a summit in Ottawa.
Reporters asked the three leaders what they would do to counter the anti-free-trade sentiment exemplified by Trump. Obama acknowledged the shortcomings of trade agreements, but he argued that reverting to tariffs and a possible trade war was the wrong way to improve the situation. He pointed to technological change as an irreversible factor.
"This nostalgia about an era when everybody was working in manufacturing jobs, and you didn’t need a college degree, and you could go in and as long as you worked hard you could support a family and live a middle-class life -- that has been undermined far more by automation than it has been by outsourcing or the shift of jobs to ... low-wage countries," Obama said. "I mean, the steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to."
I was talking about the fuel consumption lie
Yes and? I am just not sure what point you are trying to make.
Are you being deliberately obtuse? There are two ways to take the statement "we have doubled the distance our cars will go". The tweet shows which one he meant.
No.
Yes.
In his state of the nation address in late January he lied and said this
"We produce more oil at home than we have in 15 years. We have doubled the distance our cars will go on a gallon of gas and the amount of renewable energy we generate from sources like wind and solar, with tens of thousands of good, American jobs to show for it.""
It's fairly fucking simple to understand:
- Either a statement of fact about the capability that has already happened, or
- Expressing the future tense.
Without a shred of evidence to support your inference, you've chosen the later despite either could be true and the subsequent tweet clearly shows which it is.
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@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
@antipodean said in US Politics:
@Baron-Silas-Greenback said in US Politics:
What? you are comparing it to what year 1975?
He was talking about his administration.
I should have mad that clear.How do you infer that?
A day after Trump’s speech, Barack Obama brought up the history of American steel during a joint appearance with the Canadian prime minister and the Mexican president, who were meeting for a summit in Ottawa.
Reporters asked the three leaders what they would do to counter the anti-free-trade sentiment exemplified by Trump. Obama acknowledged the shortcomings of trade agreements, but he argued that reverting to tariffs and a possible trade war was the wrong way to improve the situation. He pointed to technological change as an irreversible factor.
"This nostalgia about an era when everybody was working in manufacturing jobs, and you didn’t need a college degree, and you could go in and as long as you worked hard you could support a family and live a middle-class life -- that has been undermined far more by automation than it has been by outsourcing or the shift of jobs to ... low-wage countries," Obama said. "I mean, the steel industry is producing as much steel in the United States as it ever was. It’s just (that) it needs one-tenth of the workers that it used to."
I was talking about the fuel consumption lie
Yes and? I am just not sure what point you are trying to make.
Are you being deliberately obtuse? There are two ways to take the statement "we have doubled the distance our cars will go". The tweet shows which one he meant.
No.
Yes.
In his state of the nation address in late January he lied and said this
"We produce more oil at home than we have in 15 years. We have doubled the distance our cars will go on a gallon of gas and the amount of renewable energy we generate from sources like wind and solar, with tens of thousands of good, American jobs to show for it.""
It's fairly fucking simple to understand:
- Either a statement of fact about the capability that has already happened, or
- Expressing the future tense.
Without a shred of evidence to support your inference, you've chosen the later despite either could be true and the subsequent tweet clearly shows which it is.
Are you just completely ignoring the link I have provided? How does me providing a link equate to you claiming I havent provided any evidence? His full speech is still on Youtube, he categorically said we HAVE doubled the distance our cars will go on a gallon of gas.
That was complete and utter BS.
The fact over 2 weeks later he tweeted the real version, doesnt make his initial statement in his SOU speech any less of a lie.
And what inference? I am not inferring anything, I am saying it outright, with evidence. .
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@NTA said in US Politics:
That is just absolutely terrible.
How about Time MagazineThe Great Manipulator?
US Politics