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Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November

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allblacksargentina
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Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November
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  • DonsteppaD Offline
    DonsteppaD Offline
    Donsteppa
    replied to booboo on last edited by Donsteppa
    #1195

    @booboo said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @Donsteppa said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @booboo said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @Donsteppa said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    Coles on the wing early, what were the odds.

    @Yeetyaah said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    Get off the wing and do your job Coles.

    It is his job

    I’d have to rewatch a few games to double check, but my impression is that it isn’t Taylor’s job to the same degree.

    That defenders of Coles often cite Fitzy from 25 years ago is instructive...

    Wasn't so much your comment but as I've gone through the thread I'm amazed at how many seem to think he's just rocking his own tactics.

    At the risk of sparking another dull anti Foster rant, he's doing exactly what the coach is asking him too.

    Good point re Taylor though. May be he's not as good at it? Or has different strengths so the tactics change to suit? Or another forward takes on that role?

    If it's clearly a coaching tactic, that's fine, some will like it, some won't (I don't, given Coles was the starting hooker in a tight five that got outplayed in all aspects by Argentina two weeks ago).

    I sometimes wonder about the 'lack of a Plan B' that the All Blacks occasionally get thrown at them... that's on the players as well as the coaching staff, and a senior player arguably should be one of the first to react.

    JB on the right wing rather than at fullback is also a coaching/selection issue, but most don't caveat their "WTF are you doing now Jordie!" live posts with that either 🙂

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  • boobooB Offline
    boobooB Offline
    booboo
    replied to nostrildamus on last edited by
    #1196

    @nostrildamus said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @No-Quarter said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @kpkanz said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @Winger You mean the tight game that Jordan blew up to 38-0 when he came on?
    You realise he scored 2 tries and set up the 3rd to make it 38-0 right? You know he didnt come in 80th minute right?

    Yeah it was really fucking nail-biting stuff at 17-0, 70% possession, 80% territory and Argentina having made nearly four times as many tackles as us. So surprised that our bench players made an impact given how tight it was.

    Jordan did make those tries out of nothing. He wasn't helped to some cushy tries by his team mates.

    I kind of agree with @Winger 's reply to this.

    His team mates forced the Argies to trying some desperate tactics. Jordan didn't make them on his own.

    A nostrildamusN P 3 Replies Last reply
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  • boobooB Offline
    boobooB Offline
    booboo
    replied to MajorRage on last edited by
    #1197

    @MajorRage was going to question that the international audience would have got Fox comms, but you're in the UK huh? And got the Sky comms not the hosts?

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  • TimT Away
    TimT Away
    Tim
    wrote on last edited by Tim
    #1198

    At 1:40:20 you can see the flip clean out of Cane:

    SiamS 1 Reply Last reply
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  • A Offline
    A Offline
    akan004
    replied to booboo on last edited by akan004
    #1199

    @booboo said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @nostrildamus said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @No-Quarter said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @kpkanz said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @Winger You mean the tight game that Jordan blew up to 38-0 when he came on?
    You realise he scored 2 tries and set up the 3rd to make it 38-0 right? You know he didnt come in 80th minute right?

    Yeah it was really fucking nail-biting stuff at 17-0, 70% possession, 80% territory and Argentina having made nearly four times as many tackles as us. So surprised that our bench players made an impact given how tight it was.

    Jordan did make those tries out of nothing. He wasn't helped to some cushy tries by his team mates.

    I kind of agree with @Winger 's reply to this.

    His team mates forced the Argies to trying some desperate tactics. Jordan didn't make them on his own.

    Both his tries came from good line speed that put the attack under pressure. More evidence that we have to start employing a blitz defence like what England and SA are doing. His second intercept try was special though, I don't think Jordie would have had the pace to have scored that.

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  • SiamS Offline
    SiamS Offline
    Siam
    replied to Tim on last edited by Siam
    #1200

    @Tim poor refereeing of what's in front of them. One guy flipped, another preventing a quick tap and the final decision for a pissy "push" - all at 82 minutes!
    Inconsistency has been a blight on rugby adjudication in 2020

    1 Reply Last reply
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  • SiamS Offline
    SiamS Offline
    Siam
    wrote on last edited by
    #1201

    While I'm on this high horse, the Lomax incident is the most clear cut instance of a deliberate forearm to the face that you will ever see on a rugby field

    1 Reply Last reply
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  • N Offline
    N Offline
    Nevorian
    replied to MN5 on last edited by
    #1202

    @MN5 said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    Did Jordie and Beaudie get some sort of family discount on haircuts this week ?

    Glad Scott didn’t get one

    1 Reply Last reply
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  • P Offline
    P Offline
    pakman
    wrote on last edited by
    #1203

    Goodhue at 13, is good defensively, runs great lines and sets his wingers up. He is wasted at 12.

    Did he get any minutes at 13? I can't recall any.

    Would have been interesting seeing him outside Laumape as a comparison.

    Did no one notice the sly hit Coles in first half put in to Kramer's ribs? He needed attention afterwards.

    1 Reply Last reply
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  • N Offline
    N Offline
    Nevorian
    replied to taniwharugby on last edited by Nevorian
    #1204

    @taniwharugby said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @Donsteppa i think it depends who they have, they like to station Coles wide whereas use Taylor in closer allowing someone else to hang on the wing.

    Pretty sure its just how they are set up rather than Coles shirking his duties

    That said, I haven't watched yet, so will be interesting to see how shit a number of players were based on comments here.

    Coles would have scored quite a few of his 13 test tries from that position now

    Could it be at tactic to have a big defender out on the wing especially one who is good at winning turnover ball at the tackle

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  • gt12G Offline
    gt12G Offline
    gt12
    wrote on last edited by
    #1205

    Although I think the midfield is not quite right and that he shouldn't be at 12, Goodhue did a great job on defence last night, equally leading the team with 8 tackles made and 1 missed (He also ran 6 times for 24 metres and beat two defenders).

    taniwharugbyT 1 Reply Last reply
    1
  • gt12G Offline
    gt12G Offline
    gt12
    wrote on last edited by
    #1206

    Other interesting stats that jump out is the effort to use Clarke more. He had 13 runs (2nd to Ardie Savea with 15) and 84 metres with two clean breaks and 4 defenders beaten. He also had at least one very good high ball take, and didn't miss a tackle. Apart from two turnovers, he was just excellent.

    Victor MeldrewV 1 Reply Last reply
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  • gt12G Offline
    gt12G Offline
    gt12
    wrote on last edited by
    #1207

    It's hard to go past Ardie in this game as well.

    Given that the Argies didn't have the ball, it was really a game for him; he lead the team in runs, with 15 - which is pretty impressive when you think about how hot it was - and scored once with 47 metres (2nd in the forwards), 7 defenders beaten (team leader), and 1 offload.

    Looking forward, if we can get more physicality from the second row (especially if BBBR comes back well) and from 6 (if Akira continues to develop), then we might be able to get away with having Cane and Ardie out there together.

    I'm not in love with the idea, but if we plan to try to hold the ball more (especially), then we could take greater advantage of his strengths.

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  • taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugby
    replied to gt12 on last edited by taniwharugby
    #1208

    @gt12 just watching game now (2nd half just started) thought he did exactly what was required in the 1st half, carried a few times, passed 4 or so other times, is often first or 2nd to breakdown, makes his tackles, I think he is doing exactly what is asked of him.

    Is amusing watching the game after reading comments that's for sure. Its like some people have comments ready to post on certain players no matter what.

    gt12G ACT CrusaderA NepiaN 3 Replies Last reply
    3
  • raznomoreR Offline
    raznomoreR Offline
    raznomore
    wrote on last edited by raznomore
    #1209

    The best part of the game happened after it finished

    Phil Kearns “Australia need a bonus point victory next week” or words to that effect

    Greg Clark “Do you think Australia can beat Argentina by 100?”

    Fuck I laughed and laughed.

    1 Reply Last reply
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  • gt12G Offline
    gt12G Offline
    gt12
    replied to taniwharugby on last edited by
    #1210

    @taniwharugby

    People on this board having pre-conceived ideas ready to spout off without evidence?

    alt text

    1 Reply Last reply
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  • nostrildamusN Online
    nostrildamusN Online
    nostrildamus
    replied to kev on last edited by
    #1211

    @kev said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @nostrildamus that is AB pattern. In structured play he runs the pattern. In unstructured play no one puts another player into better space with the timing of the pass. To say he is not a distributor is incorrect.

    Sorry what are you replying to? Something someone else said? Are you defending JG? I think someone else said he isn't a distributor. I'd agree he is one at, at 13, but last night and at 12 not so much, he backed himself a bit and didn't get very far.

    taniwharugbyT 1 Reply Last reply
    1
  • taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugbyT Offline
    taniwharugby
    replied to nostrildamus on last edited by taniwharugby
    #1212

    @nostrildamus just watching the game now and struggling to understand the criticism of his distribution.

    He passed more than he ran, most were short passes with close runners, one was a well timed pop to Clarke at pace.

    IMO everything that was expected of him.

    nostrildamusN 1 Reply Last reply
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  • nostrildamusN Online
    nostrildamusN Online
    nostrildamus
    replied to booboo on last edited by
    #1213

    @booboo said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @nostrildamus said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @No-Quarter said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @kpkanz said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @Winger You mean the tight game that Jordan blew up to 38-0 when he came on?
    You realise he scored 2 tries and set up the 3rd to make it 38-0 right? You know he didnt come in 80th minute right?

    Yeah it was really fucking nail-biting stuff at 17-0, 70% possession, 80% territory and Argentina having made nearly four times as many tackles as us. So surprised that our bench players made an impact given how tight it was.

    Jordan did make those tries out of nothing. He wasn't helped to some cushy tries by his team mates.

    I kind of agree with @Winger 's reply to this.

    His team mates forced the Argies to trying some desperate tactics. Jordan didn't make them on his own.

    Jordan showed great anticipation, aggression, timing, ball skills, and speed. Jordie would not have made those tries in minutes 1, 2, or 80. When Jordan sped away the Argie 15 (and was it a wing?) had plenty of time to catch up and they tried-they never gained ground on him. You can say it was tinny luck for both tries (not the help in the third) but Jordan had the skills to capitalize. He could well be found out defensively, he could be worse than Jordie at 15 at AB level. But at the moment we have no idea, and that is game six, and the season is over.
    In that wing position though. who has played better for the ABs over the six games? It is criminal that sort of potential has not been tested earlier.

    Victor MeldrewV 1 Reply Last reply
    3
  • nostrildamusN Online
    nostrildamusN Online
    nostrildamus
    replied to taniwharugby on last edited by nostrildamus
    #1214

    @taniwharugby said in Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November:

    @nostrildamus just watching the game now and struggling to understand the criticism of his distribution.

    He passed more than he ran, most were short passes with close runners, one was a well timed pop to Clarke at pace.

    IMO everything that was expected of him.

    Who are you talking about? JG? He was sound defensively, I recall some short passes (and he has a beautiful longer one) but the midfield as a whole was not cohesive and efficient on attack. When ALB and JG were 12 and 13 (last year I think?) it seemed to flow that much better.
    I am actually a JG fan, at 13 his rugby brain is so astute. Against the English, he was one of the better players. But the backline is cramped, it stutters, and he is at 12. Perhaps it is tactics, perhaps due to another player (but not at 9, we had Smith last night) but I don't think it is because of the opposition.
    NB everyone seems to think I criticized JG's distribution, I don't recall that! I do think he seems to be in the wrong positon and he lacks top end pace.

    SnowyS 1 Reply Last reply
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Argentina Two: Newcastle, 28 November
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