RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D)
-
@taniwharugby said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@WillieTheWaiter Bismarck du Plessis was YCd for leading with the elbow/forearm on Messam wasnt he?
not sure. Obviously the fact i'm generally drunk during AB matches would impact my memory of that!
Whenever I was playing rugby there was always 'a guy' that would steam into contact leading with the forearm.. it is farking dangerous and i've always been surprised it's never been under the microscope a bit more. Focus always on the tackler. But if they do look into it where does it end.. I mean dropping hte shoulder into contact when carrying has always been fine.. can of bloody worms!
-
@taniwharugby said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@WillieTheWaiter Bismarck du Plessis was YCd for leading with the elbow/forearm on Messam wasnt he?
That incident is different from the one yesterday. Raising the forearm up before contact and away from your own body as a shield above someone's shoulder line has always been penalised.
World Rugby now need to come out and clearly state that it shouldn't have been subject to sanction.
-
@WillieTheWaiter said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
rugby there was always 'a guy' that would steam into contact leading with the forearm.. it is farking dangerous and i've always been surprised it's never been under the microscope a bit more. Focus always on the tackler. But if they do look into it where does it end.. I mean dropping hte shoulder into contact when carrying has always been fine.. can of bloody worms!
It was the game where he then hit DC slightly high and late and got a 2nd YC
@antipodean I am only going from memory on the BDP one.
-
@WillieTheWaiter said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
The issue here is that he's pretty much the 1st person in the history of the game that's been pinged for leading into the tackle with his forearm..
Not strictly true - one of our guys got done for it in 2007.
Edit: Lane Cove v Rouse Hill. Think it was ex-Gisborne player Tom Solomon running over Covies' fullback 🤔 might have been 2008
-
@taniwharugby said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@NTA he is, but in the middle they could have over-ruled him...
I know it isnt always thier fault, but they are still somehow involved, like controversy follows them....
Firstly, I'd like to take some time to point out I'm blaming a Kiwi
Secondly, I have a hazy memory of Skeen being involved in something stupid from the TMO's desk before.
And Thirdly, French refs are here to stay, because the rest of the world can't seem to get their guys a seat at the table.
Allow me to demonstrate why:
-
Probably been noted but his arm/elbow wasn't extended - he was almost doing a T-Rex to keep from extending it before impact. This really blurs the line around what goes on in the collision.
Seems they are hunting for stuff to penalise now - and the wording and handover to the refs is fraught as fark. They need to empower the ref to play a flat bat and leave it for the citing team if needed. Or some simple mechanism to avoid the ref having to penalise stuff he'd typically let go as part and parcel of a contact sport.
-
@NTA Skeen sounds like it could be a French name.
-
when your governing body comes out after a week of the tournament and says "the refs have been shit, we need to do better" this is exactly what you are going to get.
When you have fans and coaches of losing teams endlessly whining about how the ref cost you the game, this is what you get.
If you need to look at an incident a thousand times over a four minute period, perhaps it is play on? But, if your governing body has publicly said you are shit, then there is no way you are letting anything slide.
As Siam i think said below, listening to them build a story that allows them to make the call they already want to make is painful.
-
@antipodean said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@taniwharugby said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@WillieTheWaiter Bismarck du Plessis was YCd for leading with the elbow/forearm on Messam wasnt he?
That incident is different from the one yesterday. Raising the forearm up before contact and away from your own body as a shield above someone's shoulder line has always been penalised.
World Rugby now need to come out and clearly state that it shouldn't have been subject to sanction.
yep, the "bumper bar" is a no no. That last night was not one of those. That action happens all the time in every game on every field the world over. This had better be called out as a mistake by World Rugby or we're in deep shit.
-
@taniwharugby said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@WillieTheWaiter Bismarck du Plessis was YCd for leading with the elbow/forearm on Messam wasnt he?
That was an elbow to the throat.
-
Now, I'm about to go all Alan Jones, create my own story, and then rail against the authorities for the way they are acting on this thing i just made up, so i will not be offended if you pull me up and call bullshit
I feel like this witch hunt on "high tackles" is stemming from the litigation against the NFL for their treatment of concussion over the year. But, it's my understanding that the law suits etc over there aren't around the way games are played, but more around the treatment of players with concussion, and the hiding of data that allowed them to keep guys on the field who had no reason being there. They have made some changes, like helmet to helmet charges being outlawed etc. But the main changes are around player welfare.
However what World Rugby have done is taken it waaaay further and tried to remove all possibilities of head injuries from a collision sport all together. Any head injury must result in a sanction against, in the vast majority of cases, the tackler. There is no longer any such thing as incidental contact, despite this being a sport that is 80 minutes of 100+kg humans smashing in to each as hard as they possibly can, carrying the ball, hitting rucks, scrums, mauls, catching kicks. Every single act in the game is a chance for incidental contact.
So we have arrived at a point where incidental contact sees a guy get sent from the field, and then get 3 weeks (for a first offense). Guys ducking in to tackles result in 5 minutes of replays to make sure there isn't a way we can send that guy off. It's lunacy, and taken way too far.
I feel like World Rugby will be fulfilling its duty of care to have strict rules around the the treatment of concussion, and to punish deliberate acts. Leave the rest as rugby accidents. But it's too late now, the toothpaste is out of the tube. And the game is suffering for it, and turning a lot of long time watchers off.
-
I think the bigger picture stinks of arse covering and prioritizing commercial success, in terms of this new pick and choose slo-mo safety crusade.
Be nice to the know the actual vision of what they want the game to look like. The end point or desired outcome.
Only waist high tackles?
No contact above chest high?
Ruck cleanouts?
No dropping your shoulder when carrying the ball?
What, World Rugby, do you want? Because the fecken rulings yesterday, at your signature event, changed in the space of 3 hours and several postcodes away!
What will your safe rugby look like? I'd like to know whether to stick around or not
-
I can rant about the refs, or the TMOs, or World Rugby. I don't think any of them covered themselves in glory last night.
But I'd rather rant about our tactics. Our mindless adherence to a one-size-fits-all game plan, while Wales pick us off with smart plays and good execution. Our ten-minute stints of madness where we forget how to pass, catch and tackle. Our complete lack of goalkicking ability.
Wales were the better team, and deserved to win. To my eyes, they are greater than the sum of their parts. I don't think you can say the same about the Wallabies.
I've said it elsewhere, but the Davies intercept was a perfect summation of the difference between the two teams. An incredibly smart tactic that was well-devised and well-executed. They did their homework and capitalised on a weakness of ours.
What did we do? Run the same shit out that we always do, and let the cards fall how they may. It's just not good enough for an international rugby side.
-
@barbarian yep, good, i'm done with officialdom now too
The Wallabies are mystifying. They seem so close, and yet so far away. There were some very interesting selections. Genia's ropey wide pass was a killer, and ruthlessly exploited. They caused a lot of problems out wide, the #8 made good metres, and Hooper was a menace. Their set piece was also really strong.
And yet they were constantly chasing the game. Wales got the headstart by arriving at the kickoff ready to play, while the Wallabies took 10 minutes to warm up. Nearly everything Foley touched turned to shit. Pocock was a passenger.
White and Toomua coming on and playing straight really changed that game. And i honestly thought at 65 minutes they would win. And then the errors compounded again (a problem all night, they make errors in clumps) and Wales ground the game in to the dust, very professionally i might add, sign of a good and confident team.
Do you reckon Cheika looks at the opposition at all? Or just relies on the team playing their way to be enough?
-
@Rapido said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@Crucial said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@taniwharugby said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
World Rugby should be concerned that Garces and Poite seem to be a part of many of the more controversial moments in games over the past few years.
One of the more astounding things was that Pocockwomble had to talk to Poite at halftime to clarify the words he was using at the rucks. I know there are language differences but that implies that his communication was inconsistent and ambiguous. For a ref of his experience and standing that is quite incredible.
Talking/coaching refs are a stupid idea IMO anyway. Very anglocentric. Very mextedy.
Disagree. In the modern game being told when the ref deems a ruck it standard practice. Hands off is the usual call
-
@Crucial said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@Rapido said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@Crucial said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@taniwharugby said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
World Rugby should be concerned that Garces and Poite seem to be a part of many of the more controversial moments in games over the past few years.
One of the more astounding things was that Pocockwomble had to talk to Poite at halftime to clarify the words he was using at the rucks. I know there are language differences but that implies that his communication was inconsistent and ambiguous. For a ref of his experience and standing that is quite incredible.
Talking/coaching refs are a stupid idea IMO anyway. Very anglocentric. Very mextedy.
Disagree. In the modern game being told when the ref deems a ruck it standard practice. Hands off is the usual call
I think he means talking to or trying to coach the refs is a bad idea. Not that the ref should be quiet during open play
-
Pocock shouldnt be talking to the ref at halftime anyway, it should be Hooper.
-
@mariner4life said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
Do you reckon Cheika looks at the opposition at all? Or just relies on the team playing their way to be enough?
Nope. I've interviewed him on the GAGR pod and he said as much.
It's such a self-defeating approach to the game in 2019.
-
@barbarian said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
@mariner4life said in RWC: Australia v Wales (Pool D):
Do you reckon Cheika looks at the opposition at all? Or just relies on the team playing their way to be enough?
Nope. I've interviewed him on the GAGR pod and he said as much.
It's such a self-defeating approach to the game in 2019.
that is actually astounding
-
@mariner4life Yeah crazy but he has repeated it often in interviews. It's as bad as his 'we don't practise kicks because we want to run it in the fair dinkum ozzie way' idea. I think that one may have changed, but he said that several times a few years ago.
