The Silver Fern

Here's the decision on that red card:

Zach Mercer red card dismissed

The Montpellier Hérault Rugby No 8, Zach Mercer, has had the red card shown to him during his club’s Heineken Champions Cup, Round of 16 match against the Exeter Chiefs at Sandy Park, dismissed following an independent Disciplinary Hearing.

Mercer was sent off by the referee, Andrew Brace (Ireland), in the 50th minute of the match for tackling the Exeter Chiefs back row, Christ Tshiunza, in a dangerous manner in contravention of Law 9.13.

>Law 9.13 A player must not tackle an opponent dangerously
Under World Rugby’s Sanctions for Foul Play, Law 9.13 relating to dangerous tackling carries the following sanction entry points – Low End: 2 weeks; Mid-range: 6 weeks; Top end: 10 to 52 weeks.

An independent Disciplinary Committee comprising David Martin (Ireland), Chair, Gordon Black (Ireland) and Bogdan Zebega (Romania), viewed footage of the incident and heard evidence by video conference from Mercer, who accepted that he had committed an act of foul play but did not accept that it warranted a red card.

The committee also heard submissions from the Montpellier Hérault Rugby Director of Rugby, Philippe Saint André, from the club’s Defence and Laws Coach, Alex Ruiz, from the club’s Team Manager, Tom Whitford, and from the EPCR Disciplinary Officer, Liam McTiernan. The club’s legal representative, Joris Loupien, was also present during the hearing.

The committee decided that although Mercer had committed an act of foul play, the tackle did not warrant a red card. The sending off was therefore dismissed and Mercer is free to play.

EPCR have the right to appeal the decision.

@nostrildamus said in 6N 2023 England v France:

@Catogrande said in 6N 2023 England v France:

Don’t assume my gender, bitch.

Don't assume @Bones' species!

That is far too difficult to call.

@Crucial said in England v France 6N:

If he was a kiwi I definitely think he’d have a fair few supporters.

New Zealand doesn't have a shortage of highlight reel fans.

@MiketheSnow But where to now for Wales, Mike? Ok get players contracts/pay sorted, but after that? Coaches have already been swapped out. Some older players need to be dropped but not all. Wales is a proud rugby country. Need a new direction/thought pattern and fast.

@Catogrande said in England v Italy 6 Nations:

@Victor-Meldrew said in England v Italy 6 Nations:

@Catogrande said in England v Italy 6 Nations:

@Victor-Meldrew said in England v Italy 6 Nations:

@Bones said in England v Italy 6 Nations:

@sparky said in England v Italy 6 Nations:

@Bones Ollie Lawrence has had a decent game

So has Chessum.

Itoje pretty anonymous. Can't work out if he was engine-room mode or just, well, anonymous.

You sure you weren't watching a recording of last week's game? Itoje played well and came up with one or two really big plays.

Nothing wrong with being anonymous if you're in the tight 5 - means you're doing the hard yakka. Thought it was a pretty uncharacteristic game for him though.

Aah! I take your point. Not as gobby as before. I did pose the question on here during the Autumn series that Itoje is not the whooping, hollering dickhead for Sarries that he is for England and whether that was an Eddie stratagem. Maybe Borthwick doesn't go for the same mind games?

Eddie has openly admitted that he encouraged it. Itoje did buy into it though and it only built on what he was doing anyway.
Let’s hope this is a sign that he’s grown up.

@Catogrande said in England v Scotland 6N:

@Machpants said in England v Scotland 6N:

@antipodean said in England v Scotland 6N:

@Machpants said in England v Scotland 6N:

SA mark 2

70 open-plays kicks in the game against Scotland on Saturday, 34 by England and 36 by Scotland. The difference looks negligible: but scratch the surface, and 13 of the England kicks were launched from positions inside the Scotland half, compared to only two by their opponents.

Testatment to the attacking brilliance of their five-eighth...

Which one?

Evans?

Nah, it was mainly from 9 as I recall and not just a shit option, shit execution too.

Yeah it was very FafDK, but crapper

@Joans-Town-Jones said in All Blacks v England:

@TheMojoman said in All Blacks v England:

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks v England:

@TheMojoman Stevenson or Lam?

I'd love to see Stevenson in the mix but IMO he would be competing for the 14 spot with Jordan, Telea and Reece potentially as 15 cover. Lam is a maybe, not sure he has the same impact as Clarke though as a power winger.

Foster (rightly IMO) clearly wants to play a power winger/finesse winger combination with his 14 also an extra FB with kicking etc. Leads me to believe Jordan will be the first choice 14 when fit. Telea has been the find of the northern tour.

I'm on the Shaun Stevenson bandwagon. He needs to be and AB.

an

@Billy-Tell said in England v Japan:

Japan tactics are baffling. They are not going to win by taking 3s.

Or running it from everywhere

@Daffy-Jaffy first Seibold now Hodgson. What’s with the Aussie leaguies for defence coaches?

@nostrildamus said in Australia v England - the decider:

@MajorRage said in Australia v England - the decider:

@Derpus said in Australia v England - the decider:

@ACT-Crusader Something seriously wrong with you if you'd rather England win.

England fans have never:

Punched me on a train after a game Ruined a dinner party over rugby
> 3. Tried to start a fight with me after the ABs lost

Cmon England.

I'd be surprised at number 3 as well..

My experience of England rugby fans over the years has been almost entirely positive. Very little in the way of unpleasantness, just the occasional bit of boorish behaviour. Maybe it’s different seeing things from an opposition viewpoint. I would also say that my overall positive view of England fans is mirrored by all the other countries too. In the main, rugby fans first, jingoistic second.

@Stargazer

Good on Mitchell for honouring the bet. Awful voice though.

@Stargazer said in Australia v England - 1st Test:

I actually agree with the decision in Swain's case. That was the softest head butt to get red-carded I've ever seen. It was stupid to respond to a provocation like that, no doubt, but it's ridiculous that he gets suspended while the grub who pulled his hair (and the incident earlier in the game) didn't even get a mandatory meeting with the Disciplinary Committee.

The softest I've ever seen was Mose Tuiali'i on Marius Joubert. It was more like a head push than a butt. Tuiali'i was red carded in the first half, the Stormers would still lose and Tuiali'i would be suspended for 3 weeks (entry point was 6 weeks).

And some say history doesn't repeat?

Swain decision definitely seems worthy of getting the blood pressure up over lol

@mariner4life said in France v England:

The damning thing for Eddie is I think England are playing less than the sum of their parts. That's on him.

Has he ever kept a job this long?

Yet Ian Foster is still in his job.

Some heated discussion:

@mikethesnow said in 6N 2022 : England v Wales:

@mariner4life said in 6N 2022 : England v Wales:

@mikethesnow said in 6N 2022 : England v Wales:

However, despite gaining loads of metres when he was brought down it either resulted in turnover ball or a penalty for holding on.

i noted a couple of very good Welsh breaks came to nothing because the support play was absolute zero. There were white jerseys everywhere scrambling, and not a red jersey in sight.

Cuthbert the best line breaker on the day and the worst culprit of running away from support

That game epitomised Cuthbert for me. All the physical attributes but just not very bright. Also i think that England missed an opportunity to put the ball behind him as his positioning is a bit suss and he has the turning circle of a supertanker.

@nta said in Scotland v England:

@pakman makes my case - when did that happen? 🙂

Vs France in Paris a few years ago

@smuts said in England vs Springbokke:

I hope @Catogrande is recovering well. But I’m also hoping the boks are heading home thinking about how critical developing a more incisive attack is.

Thank you. My recovery was going well but due to recent self medication consisting mainly of Chenin blanc, I may be relapsing.

@nta said in England v Australia:

@higgins no ruck - play on, unfortunately.

Further to that: the option for Ikitau was to hit the deck and wait, but it wouldn't have made a lot of difference - only Leota and McDermott were in frame and there were about 8 Poms on their feet.

@junior I think NZ have been able to get this from their coaches who have been overseas and had to fashion game plans based on the players at their disposal. It has forced them to innovate.

Maybe an idea for NZ would be to (shock, horror) invite some non-NZers to coach in NZ and introduce NZ players to different approaches and techniques. Worked ok for the Crusaders with Ronan O'Gara.

Fine's tour over following three match ban

Winger Viliami Fine will miss Tonga's remaining tour matches against the French Barbarians and Romania after he was suspended for three weeks following his sending off against England.

The 23-year-old appeared before an independent judicial committee via video link, having received a red card for striking the head of England's replacement flyhalf Marcus Smith.

Fine was dismissed 13 minutes after coming onto the field as a replacement for Walter Fifita and admitted the incident was worthy of a red card.

The Disciplinary Committee ruled the Otago winger struck his opponent with the upper part of his arm, that the strike was not powerful and there was no injury to the player.

The suspension was halved from six weeks to three, after the committee accounted for Fine's clean record, early guilty plea, apology to Smith and the way in which he approached the disciplinary process.

Viliame Fine will also be banned for a third match which is still to be determined. He has the right to appeal the suspension within 48 hours.

Nov 11, 2021  /  Pacific Tonga make five changes for French Baabaas clash Tonga make five changes for French Baabaas clash

Tonga have made five personnel changes to their starting fifteen to take on the French Barbarians in their latest Northern rugby tour match in Lyon.

@bovidae Yeah, although at her age and players only being part-time (less than semi-)professionals at test level, other life choices may have taken over that don't allow for international rugby, camps etc. Hirini isn't there either.

@l_n_p said in Eddie Jones confirms he's finishing up at England after RWC2023:

@machpants

Good article on Nick Dolly, the (aussie) England hooker but with a very Oz background

I only came to the UK to visit my grandparents — now I’m an England international

Headline writes itself: "Well Hello Dolly!"

@cgrant said in England v Canada:

@sparky said in England v Canada:

@bones Favourites for 2023 RWC iMHO.

Not if Eddie Jones is their coach.

I think he is trying to unfurl a very long joke/setup about how unbeatable England would be if they played the ABs again.
At the moment I think that is a rather dangerous ploy.

@Catogrande said in RWC - how the poms beat us..:

@Smuts said in RWC - how the poms beat us..:

@antipodean that is some very tough marking.

But pretty much true. Eddie virtually admitted as much during an evening audience with him. From the word go he was targeting NZ in RWC 2019. It was the same in 2003 and both times it worked but maybe came a game too early.

I think the opening line of the vid summed it up well - he’s the master of the upset.

I wonder if he thought to himself (secretly) that he could afford to do that because England would have enough talent to beat whoever made it to the final from the other side of the draw without giving them as much focus as the All Blacks (certainly a year out I thought that might be his approach just looking at the way draw was likely to pan out)

@Crucial I never said he was ok with it. There's been a few comments pointing at his response showing that he wanted the book thrown at Marler, and similar. He never said any such thing.

But yeah make up a rant about something else.

@NTA said in England Vs Ireland, Six Nations 2020:

Intensity from the Poms was great but Ireland didn't adapt or adjust to any of it.

Not the only team in recent history for that to happen to!

@Catogrande said in Scotland vs England, Six Nations 2020:

@sparky Nah mate, you can tell it was bad. some of the Scots had got their long sleeve shirts on.

Ah yes. Saturday night then.

nig.jpg

@NTA From 2007 to 2011 my TSF moniker was "Winning Ugly is still Winning." I think I might put it back

@Catogrande said in [Poll] Who would you prefer to win?:

@Tim said in [Poll] Who would you prefer to win?:

@booboo No, @Catogrande is having consolation sex with Katie Hopkins.

Which would explain my lack of posting yesterday, It took me ages to escape from her cellar.

She must watch too many movies

alt text

That is rather amusing.

I wonder what the Lions did to him?

Intercept passes are classified as turnovers.

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@kiwiinmelb said in RWC: England v Argentina (Pool C):

@westcoastie said in RWC: England v Argentina (Pool C):

@kiwiinmelb said in RWC: England v Argentina (Pool C):

On the send off . sin bin rule, I follow AFL which has none, and the players get harshly dealt with at a tribunal ,

like anything , there are positives and negatives,

you dont get games decided by the send off which is probably better from a spectacle point of view,

but you could argue the team on the receiving end of the foul play doesnt receive enough compensation , particularly if they have lost a player through that foul play , the team that plays them next it could be argued benefits , because of the suspension,

And it does open a window for a player in a big game to go a bit nuts knowing he wont be sent off

you could change it but i dont think it fixes everything

What about, automatic 7pt try, red player gets replaced, and sent to tribunal for a heavy suspension

I personally would like this given a trial, a 10 minute sin bin , except that player is gone for good, when the 10 is up he is replaced by someone from the bench.

It’s a bit of a compromise, games won’t be so harshly ruined so to speak, and that player cops a harsh punishment personally.

I like what was suggested above too, and add an automatic penalty try 7 points

Also posted in the "Judidial Happenings" thread:

England centre Piers Francis cleared to play - citing not upheld

England centre Piers Francis attended a disciplinary hearing on 29 September having been cited for an act of foul play contrary to Law 9.13 (dangerous high tackle) in England’s Rugby World Cup 2019 match against USA on 26 September. The independent Judicial Committee was chaired by Nigel Hampton QC (New Zealand), joined by former international coach Frank Hadden (Scotland) and former international player John Langford (Australia). The player admitted that he had committed an act of foul play but denied that it reached the red card threshold. Having considered all the angles of the incident, together with evidence from the player and submissions from his legal counsel, the panel determined that the act ought to have resulted in a yellow card on-field. Since the threshold for upholding a citing is ‘red card’, the Committee did not uphold the citing and the player is free to play again immediately. The Committee followed the High Tackle Sanction Framework (HTSF) in order to make its decision. The player accepted that it was a high tackle that made contact with the head of the opposition ball carrier. He also accepted that a high degree of danger was present. Following the HTSF, this results in a starting point of a red card. The Committee then considered whether mitigating factors should result in the sanction being decreased. The Committee decided that there was significant and sufficient mitigation to be found: * in the sudden change of height by the USA player immediately before contact. It was only at the time of that sudden change that the clear line of sight factor (against mitigation) came in to play and could become of relevance; and that line of sight factor, therefore, was somewhat limited in its application, and the weight to be given to it; * in that the Player, being in control of the tackle, attempted to avoid the opponent’s head by making a definite attempt to change his own height and his body position; * in the Player’s initial contact being with his own head on the ball carrier’s left shoulder (and which initial contact absorbed a large degree of force), with the Player’s left shoulder then slipping up to make indirect and minor contact to the ball carrier’s head, causing no apparent injury. The Committee weighed up the factors for and against mitigation and on the balance of probabilities, decided that the mitigating factors outweighed the factors against mitigation and so the appropriate on-field sanction was a yellow card. The citing was therefore not upheld. world.rugby Disciplinary update: Piers Francis (England) | Rugby World Cup Disciplinary update: Piers Francis (England) | Rugby World Cup

England centre Piers Francis is cleared to play by independent judicial committee after he was cited for an act of foul play in match against USA.

Extended highlights:

Very late report from Dublin hotel. Quick chat last night to Joe Schmidt, who seems quietly confident.

Had seats with other NZ fans in the rafters behind South Stand. Amazing lateral view, which gives a totally different perspective from TV pictures.

Unexpected to find myself applauding English play in first 30, when it was bucketing...

After BBBR shells kick off, England make simple, safe, passes making a few yards each time, get close and run a decoy move to leave Ashton unmarked. He dives early to ensure try certain.

Whereas our tactical kicking was inaccurate and seemed to involve Benda making miraculous recoveries in such conditions, Poms were excellent. Young's box kick landing three metres in from touch. Runners make no attempt to catch, but know AB receiver will be vulnerable to a strong tackle on landing and can easily be bundled into touch. Thirty metres gain and put in to lineout.

Pressure on our lineout, leading to Taylor overthrow.

As they recovered ball from our kick off and AB defence hanging back to resist big runners, OF drops in to pocket for easy droppie. Three points and means ABs have to guard an extra threat next time.

Good use of touchline as extra defender. Even Benda forced out when getting within 5m of touch as very slippery.

15-0 was entirely deserved.

In contrast, ABs tried to shift ball as if it were dry. A pragmatic approach needed in the conditions.

Kicking too optimistic, and ill directed. When we get penalty BB kicks for distance, and although crosses line of touch low enough to be pulled back into play under new laws. In contrast 5m shorter and we have lineout in their 22, at a time here we desperately needed to get some momentum.

Some observations, some of which I'm sure have already been made.

Crotty coming on was pivotal. Not that SBW was that bad. Main thing was Crotty's 'grey hair' allowed him to settle BB down and play the percentages, something which SBW can't bring. Also Crotty kept it simple. In the conditions good lines and hard running paid lots of dividends. No need for the fancy dan plays.

Which brings me on to Josh Goodhue. Sitting high behind the posts I could appreciate just what good lines he ran in first half. Very Conradesque. Not given proper credit. The try was a direct result of him running a brilliant line and getting many yards up to their 22, from which point others did their part.

Not reported, but the rain stopped after 30ish and the ABs (with Crotty) were a different team. Secure handling, fast ball and the Poms were right under the pump.

Likewise, rain started to lash again in last 15 or so at which point England much more dangerous.

Not sure picked up here but Itoje said in press that when Barrett (S) came on ABs shifted from zonal lineout defence to man for man. Poms never came to grips with that. BBBR owned them, although why they kept throwing to Itoje is beyond me.

One last thought -- with today's refs you don't ever want to be within seven in last five. Had Ardie and Aaron executed that try in third quarter, TJP chargedown would have been of academic interest. Big kick up RRRs for the two As.

@Catogrande listening to Steve Tew, it was never really on the cards, and the beat up about Ritchie vetoing the Baabaa game was just that, a media beat up.

Supposedly the England option was made available by the RFU when the Baabaa fixture was supposedly in doubt.